[Lnc-business] Fwd: Judicial Committee motions
Alicia Mattson
alicia.mattson at lp.org
Sat Jul 21 03:02:32 EDT 2018
This strange posturing by the former Judicial Committee really makes it
problematic for us to implement the Not-A-Judicial-Committee Committee,
which would be rules compliant.
-Alicia
On Fri, Jul 20, 2018 at 11:56 PM, Alicia Mattson <alicia.mattson at lp.org>
wrote:
> There are several serious problems with the logic of this communication
> from Mr. Moulton.
>
> I see no ambiguity in Bylaw Article 8.1, which provides that, "The
> Judicial Committee shall take office immediately upon the close of the
> Regular Non-Presidential Convention at which elected and shall serve until
> the final adjournment of the next Regular Non-Presidential Convention."
>
> I see no reasonable argument to be made that the 2016-2018 Judicial
> Committee members held any position from which they could (after convention
> adjournment on July 3) conduct email votes, fill vacancies, or resign from
> positions they no longer held.
>
> A motion they purported to pass to fill vacancies was contingent on 6
> people resigning. But 6 people didn't resign, because Gary Johnson
> understood he had no position from which to resign, so the fill-the-vacancy
> motion has no effect because the condition wasn't met. So all 7 are still
> on the JC? Then 5 people purported to resign. With the prior motion
> failing to meet its condition for effectiveness, the vacancies aren't
> filled. Now Gary Johnson and Chuck Moulton are the remaining JC members?
>
> So now will Chuck Moulton conduct an email ballot in which only he votes,
> and Gary Johnson refuses to participate, and will Chuck Moulton fill 6
> vacancies or 5? He can't fill Gary Johnson's spot. By Moulton's premise,
> there is no vacancy to fill, because Johnson hasn't resigned. He can't
> apply Gary Johnson's premise to Johnson only and say he's no longer on the
> JC because his term ended at adjournment, but Moulton is somehow still on.
> The rules aren't different for Johnson versus the rest of the former JC
> members. So how does Moulton come up with a new JC that doesn't include
> Johnson?
>
> Clearly I cannot choose the glass in front of you, and clearly I cannot
> choose the glass in front of me. Wait, what's that?! (pointing, switches
> glasses, but they're both poisoned)
>
> Would the JC candidates who stood in front of the delegates on July 3 and
> pledged to apply the rules as written like to now explain how any of this
> is an example of applying the rules as written? And how any future rulings
> from them will apply the rules in an equally rational manner?
>
> -Alicia in Wonderland
>
>
>
>
>
> On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:21 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> Please see the below communication from Chuck Moulton.
>>
>> Which brings to mind another way to handle. Since the maybe JC did
>> this outside of our direction - if we refer ratification of this to the
>> delegates my mail - majority vote- we have as legitimate of JC that we
>> are going to get.
>>
>> -Caryn Ann
>>
>> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
>> From: Chuck Moulton <[1]chuck at moulton.org>
>> Date: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:41 AM
>> Subject: Judicial Committee motions
>> To: Nick Sarwark <[2]chair at lp.org>, Caryn Ann Harlos
>> <[3]secretary at lp.org>
>> CC: D Frank Robinson <[4]dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com>, Chuck Moulton
>> <[5]chuck at moulton.org>, Darryl Perry <[6]Darryl at darrylwperry.com>,
>> Ruth
>> Bennett <[7]bennettruthaz at gmail.com>, Geoff Neale
>> <[8]liber8or at austin.rr.com>, Jim Turney <[9]LP at jimturney.com>, Tricia
>> Sprankle <[10]tricia at spranklelaw.com>, Alicia Dearn
>> <[11]aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com>, William Hall <[12]WHall at wnj.com>,
>> John Buttrick <[13]jabuttrick at gmail.com>, Rob Latham
>> <[14]freeutahns at gmail.com>, Michael Badnarik
>> <[15]scholar at constitutionpreservation.org>, Gary Johnson
>> <[16]sedition at aol.com>
>> Chuck Moulton wrote (7/6/2018 at 4:31 pm):
>> > Because no one received a majority vote with approval voting, there
>> is a
>> > controversy as to whether the Judicial Committee was properly
>> elected.
>> >
>> > Without getting into details of the relative merits of each
>> > interpretation, I believe this is an exhaustive list:
>> >
>> > 1. The convention elected all 7 JC members by plurality (the motion
>> to
>> > suspend the rules for at-large applies to JC because our rules say
>> the
>> > JC uses the same method of election as at-large).
>> >
>> > 2. The convention elected 5 JC members by plurality (the motion
>> > referenced above explicitly said the top 5 would be elected by
>> plurality)
>> >
>> > 3. The JC from the previous term continues serving another 2 or 4
>> years
>> > (no one received a majority)
>> >
>> > 4. The LNC can appoint the JC (the LNC can fill at-large vacancies,
>> and
>> > our rules say the JC is elected by the same method as at-large)
>> >
>> > 5. We have no JC (no one received a majority and our bylaws say the
>> JC
>> > serves until the final adjournment of the next convention rather than
>> > when the next JC is elected)
>> >
>> > I can't do anything about interpretation #5.
>> >
>> > I am trying my best to at least make the interpretations in #1, #2,
>> #3,
>> > and #4 be the same people so those with different interpretations
>> don't
>> > think we have 4 different JCs. I believe this will add to the
>> > legitimacy of the JC.
>> Mr. Chair and Ms. Secretary,
>> Please relay the following information to the Libertarian National
>> Committee. I write both on behalf of the 2016-2018 Judicial Committee
>> and on behalf of the 2018-2020 Judicial Committee.
>> First (to harmonize #3 with #1), the Judicial Committee from the
>> 2016-2018 term (which consisted of Michael Badnarik, John Buttrick,
>> Alicia Dearn, Bill Hall, Gary E. Johnson, Rob Latham, and Chuck Moulton
>> with Chuck Moulton serving as chair) passed the following motion by
>> email ballot with a vote of 6-0-1:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial Committee
>> to fill the 6 vacancies created upon the resignations of 6 members of
>> the Judicial Committee:
>> * D. Frank Robinson
>> * Darryl Perry
>> * Ruth Bennett
>> * Geoff Neale
>> * Jim Turney
>> * Tricia Sprankle
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> The following members of the old JC submitted letters of resignation
>> contingent on the motion passing:
>> * Alicia Dearn
>> * John Buttrick
>> * Bill Hall
>> * Rob Latham
>> * Michael Badnarik
>> Gary E. Johnson did not respond to emails, participate in the vote, or
>> submit a letter of resignation. By phone he told me that he is not on
>> the Judicial Committee. He also believes we have no JC this term.
>> Second (to harmonize #2 with #1), the Judicial Committee which was
>> arguably elected by plurality for the 2016-2018 term under the
>> interpretation that the top 5 (but not the top 7) were elected (which
>> consisted of D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry, Ruth
>> Bennett, and Geoff Neale with Chuck Moulton serving as interim chair)
>> passed the following motion by email ballot with a vote of 5-0-0:
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial Committee
>> to fill the 2 vacancies left on Judicial Committee (if such vacancies
>> exist):
>> * Jim Turney
>> * Tricia Sprankle
>> ----------------------------------------------------------------------
>> At this point we 7 (D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry,
>> Ruth
>> Bennett, Geoff Neale, Jim Turney, and Tricia Sprankle) plan to elect a
>> committee chair and consider rules of appellate procedure to submit to
>> the Libertarian National Committee by the 90 day deadline in bylaw 8.3.
>> We realize that the JC election may still be a mess, but any further
>> resolution is out of our hands. Therefore, we will proceed as if we
>> were legitimately elected in order to meet bylaws deadlines.
>> Chuck Moulton
>> Interim Chair, 2018-2020 LP Judicial Committee
>> Chair, 2016-2018 LP Judicial Committee
>>
>> --
>>
>> --
>> In Liberty,
>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>> - [17]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> We defend your rights
>> And oppose the use of force
>> Taxation is theft
>>
>> References
>>
>> 1. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
>> 2. mailto:chair at lp.org
>> 3. mailto:secretary at lp.org
>> 4. mailto:dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com
>> 5. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
>> 6. mailto:Darryl at darrylwperry.com
>> 7. mailto:bennettruthaz at gmail.com
>> 8. mailto:liber8or at austin.rr.com
>> 9. mailto:LP at jimturney.com
>> 10. mailto:tricia at spranklelaw.com
>> 11. mailto:aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com
>> 12. mailto:WHall at wnj.com
>> 13. mailto:jabuttrick at gmail.com
>> 14. mailto:freeutahns at gmail.com
>> 15. mailto:scholar at constitutionpreservation.org
>> 16. mailto:sedition at aol.com
>> 17. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>
>
>
-------------- next part --------------
This strange posturing by the former Judicial Committee really makes it
problematic for us to implement the Not-A-Judicial-Committee Committee,
which would be rules compliant.
-Alicia
On Fri, Jul 20, 2018 at 11:56 PM, Alicia Mattson
<[1]alicia.mattson at lp.org> wrote:
There are several serious problems with the logic of this communication
from Mr. Moulton.
I see no ambiguity in Bylaw Article 8.1, which provides that, "The
Judicial Committee shall take office immediately upon the close of the
Regular Non-Presidential Convention at which elected and shall serve
until the final adjournment of the next Regular Non-Presidential
Convention."
I see no reasonable argument to be made that the 2016-2018 Judicial
Committee members held any position from which they could (after
convention adjournment on July 3) conduct email votes, fill vacancies,
or resign from positions they no longer held.
A motion they purported to pass to fill vacancies was contingent on 6
people resigning. But 6 people didn't resign, because Gary Johnson
understood he had no position from which to resign, so the
fill-the-vacancy motion has no effect because the condition wasn't
met. So all 7 are still on the JC? Then 5 people purported to resign.
With the prior motion failing to meet its condition for effectiveness,
the vacancies aren't filled. Now Gary Johnson and Chuck Moulton are
the remaining JC members?
So now will Chuck Moulton conduct an email ballot in which only he
votes, and Gary Johnson refuses to participate, and will Chuck Moulton
fill 6 vacancies or 5? He can't fill Gary Johnson's spot. By
Moulton's premise, there is no vacancy to fill, because Johnson hasn't
resigned. He can't apply Gary Johnson's premise to Johnson only and
say he's no longer on the JC because his term ended at adjournment, but
Moulton is somehow still on. The rules aren't different for Johnson
versus the rest of the former JC members. So how does Moulton come up
with a new JC that doesn't include Johnson?
Clearly I cannot choose the glass in front of you, and clearly I cannot
choose the glass in front of me. Wait, what's that?! (pointing,
switches glasses, but they're both poisoned)
Would the JC candidates who stood in front of the delegates on July 3
and pledged to apply the rules as written like to now explain how any
of this is an example of applying the rules as written? And how any
future rulings from them will apply the rules in an equally rational
manner?
-Alicia in Wonderland
On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:21 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
<[2]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
Please see the below communication from Chuck Moulton.
Which brings to mind another way to handle. Since the maybe JC
did
this outside of our direction - if we refer ratification of this
to the
delegates my mail - majority vote- we have as legitimate of JC
that we
are going to get.
-Caryn Ann
---------- Forwarded message ---------
From: Chuck Moulton <[1][3]chuck at moulton.org>
Date: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:41 AM
Subject: Judicial Committee motions
To: Nick Sarwark <[2][4]chair at lp.org>, Caryn Ann Harlos
<[3][5]secretary at lp.org>
CC: D Frank Robinson <[4][6]dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com>, Chuck
Moulton
<[5][7]chuck at moulton.org>, Darryl Perry
<[6][8]Darryl at darrylwperry.com>, Ruth
Bennett <[7][9]bennettruthaz at gmail.com>, Geoff Neale
<[8][10]liber8or at austin.rr.com>, Jim Turney
<[9][11]LP at jimturney.com>, Tricia
Sprankle <[10][12]tricia at spranklelaw.com>, Alicia Dearn
<[11][13]aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com>, William Hall
<[12][14]WHall at wnj.com>,
John Buttrick <[13][15]jabuttrick at gmail.com>, Rob Latham
<[14][16]freeutahns at gmail.com>, Michael Badnarik
<[15][17]scholar at constitutionpreservation.org>, Gary Johnson
<[16][18]sedition at aol.com>
Chuck Moulton wrote (7/6/2018 at 4:31 pm):
> Because no one received a majority vote with approval voting,
there
is a
> controversy as to whether the Judicial Committee was properly
elected.
>
> Without getting into details of the relative merits of each
> interpretation, I believe this is an exhaustive list:
>
> 1. The convention elected all 7 JC members by plurality (the
motion
to
> suspend the rules for at-large applies to JC because our rules
say
the
> JC uses the same method of election as at-large).
>
> 2. The convention elected 5 JC members by plurality (the motion
> referenced above explicitly said the top 5 would be elected by
plurality)
>
> 3. The JC from the previous term continues serving another 2 or
4
years
> (no one received a majority)
>
> 4. The LNC can appoint the JC (the LNC can fill at-large
vacancies,
and
> our rules say the JC is elected by the same method as at-large)
>
> 5. We have no JC (no one received a majority and our bylaws say
the
JC
> serves until the final adjournment of the next convention
rather than
> when the next JC is elected)
>
> I can't do anything about interpretation #5.
>
> I am trying my best to at least make the interpretations in #1,
#2,
#3,
> and #4 be the same people so those with different
interpretations
don't
> think we have 4 different JCs. I believe this will add to the
> legitimacy of the JC.
Mr. Chair and Ms. Secretary,
Please relay the following information to the Libertarian
National
Committee. I write both on behalf of the 2016-2018 Judicial
Committee
and on behalf of the 2018-2020 Judicial Committee.
First (to harmonize #3 with #1), the Judicial Committee from the
2016-2018 term (which consisted of Michael Badnarik, John
Buttrick,
Alicia Dearn, Bill Hall, Gary E. Johnson, Rob Latham, and Chuck
Moulton
with Chuck Moulton serving as chair) passed the following motion
by
email ballot with a vote of 6-0-1:
-----------------------------------------------------------
-----------
I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
Committee
to fill the 6 vacancies created upon the resignations of 6
members of
the Judicial Committee:
* D. Frank Robinson
* Darryl Perry
* Ruth Bennett
* Geoff Neale
* Jim Turney
* Tricia Sprankle
-----------------------------------------------------------
-----------
The following members of the old JC submitted letters of
resignation
contingent on the motion passing:
* Alicia Dearn
* John Buttrick
* Bill Hall
* Rob Latham
* Michael Badnarik
Gary E. Johnson did not respond to emails, participate in the
vote, or
submit a letter of resignation. By phone he told me that he is
not on
the Judicial Committee. He also believes we have no JC this
term.
Second (to harmonize #2 with #1), the Judicial Committee which
was
arguably elected by plurality for the 2016-2018 term under the
interpretation that the top 5 (but not the top 7) were elected
(which
consisted of D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry, Ruth
Bennett, and Geoff Neale with Chuck Moulton serving as interim
chair)
passed the following motion by email ballot with a vote of 5-0-0:
-----------------------------------------------------------
-----------
I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
Committee
to fill the 2 vacancies left on Judicial Committee (if such
vacancies
exist):
* Jim Turney
* Tricia Sprankle
-----------------------------------------------------------
-----------
At this point we 7 (D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl
Perry,
Ruth
Bennett, Geoff Neale, Jim Turney, and Tricia Sprankle) plan to
elect a
committee chair and consider rules of appellate procedure to
submit to
the Libertarian National Committee by the 90 day deadline in
bylaw 8.3.
We realize that the JC election may still be a mess, but any
further
resolution is out of our hands. Therefore, we will proceed as if
we
were legitimately elected in order to meet bylaws deadlines.
Chuck Moulton
Interim Chair, 2018-2020 LP Judicial Committee
Chair, 2016-2018 LP Judicial Committee
--
--
In Liberty,
Caryn Ann Harlos
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
- [17]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
We defend your rights
And oppose the use of force
Taxation is theft
References
1. mailto:[19]chuck at moulton.org
2. mailto:[20]chair at lp.org
3. mailto:[21]secretary at lp.org
4. mailto:[22]dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com
5. mailto:[23]chuck at moulton.org
6. mailto:[24]Darryl at darrylwperry.com
7. mailto:[25]bennettruthaz at gmail.com
8. mailto:[26]liber8or at austin.rr.com
9. mailto:[27]LP at jimturney.com
10. mailto:[28]tricia at spranklelaw.com
11. mailto:[29]aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com
12. mailto:[30]WHall at wnj.com
13. mailto:[31]jabuttrick at gmail.com
14. mailto:[32]freeutahns at gmail.com
15. mailto:[33]scholar at constitutionpreservation.org
16. mailto:[34]sedition at aol.com
17. mailto:[35]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
References
1. mailto:alicia.mattson at lp.org
2. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
3. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
4. mailto:chair at lp.org
5. mailto:secretary at lp.org
6. mailto:dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com
7. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
8. mailto:Darryl at darrylwperry.com
9. mailto:bennettruthaz at gmail.com
10. mailto:liber8or at austin.rr.com
11. mailto:LP at jimturney.com
12. mailto:tricia at spranklelaw.com
13. mailto:aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com
14. mailto:WHall at wnj.com
15. mailto:jabuttrick at gmail.com
16. mailto:freeutahns at gmail.com
17. mailto:scholar at constitutionpreservation.org
18. mailto:sedition at aol.com
19. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
20. mailto:chair at lp.org
21. mailto:secretary at lp.org
22. mailto:dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com
23. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
24. mailto:Darryl at darrylwperry.com
25. mailto:bennettruthaz at gmail.com
26. mailto:liber8or at austin.rr.com
27. mailto:LP at jimturney.com
28. mailto:tricia at spranklelaw.com
29. mailto:aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com
30. mailto:WHall at wnj.com
31. mailto:jabuttrick at gmail.com
32. mailto:freeutahns at gmail.com
33. mailto:scholar at constitutionpreservation.org
34. mailto:sedition at aol.com
35. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
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