[Lnc-business] New email list problem

Sun Jan 21 22:27:21 EST 2018

	As originally written, my message below included some boldface and italicized text, but that information seems to have been somehow automatically deleted from what has reached the list. Some dashes also seem to have been converted into gibberish, and a number in brackets (e.g. "[1]") has mysteriously appeared in front of every email address or web link that I included in my email.

	I am guessing these new issues may be related to Ken Moellman's continuing efforts to fix another problem which was discussed during the last IT Committee meeting after again being brought to my attention by LP member Chuck Moulton (the fact that some messages posted to the LNC list have been showing up in the online list archives with visible HTML code, making them difficult to read), and so am copying Ken to make him aware of this latest problem.

Love & Liberty,

                                   ((( starchild )))
At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
                        RealReform at earthlink.net
                                (415) 625-FREE


On Jan 21, 2018, at 6:54 PM, Starchild wrote:

>    Thank you for your reply, Alison. Like Caryn Ann, I'm glad to hear you
>   say that the reporter got it wrong and you do not support legislation
>   to punish local governments for not cooperating with federal
>   anti-immigrant enforcement efforts.
> 
>   Since you describe yourself as an anarcho-capitalist, I presume you
>   consider all government laws to be fundamentally immoral and
>   illegitimate, but given the evident confusion with what was reported,
>   the Saratoga Herald-Tribune will probably want to hear a more specific
>   disclaimer before publishing a correction.
> 
>   I realize you're busy with your campaign and have asked for help, so if
>   you will give me just a quick written statement clearly affirming that
>   you oppose efforts to ban or crack down on "sanctuary cities" in
>   Florida, such as the legislation described
>   at [1]http://floridapolitics.com/archives/248759-sanctuary-city-ban-bil
>   l-makes-comeback, I will pass the information along and work on getting
>   the paper to correct their story for the record, so that neither your
>   campaign nor the libertarian position on immigration are
>   mischaracterized.
> 
>   I already left a voicemail for the reporter, Zac Anderson [he's at
>   (941) 361-4836, or email [2]zac.anderson at heraldtribune.com], giving him
>   the heads-up that his story apparently got your position wrong and
>   asking him to call me back. According to the paper's website, he is
>   their political editor as well as a reporter, so I'm guessing he has
>   authority to address the issue himself and didn't attempt to contact
>   another editor.
> 
>                      *          *          *
> 
>   Regarding the immigration issue in general, here is some information I
>   hope you or other Libertarian candidates may find helpful when
>   communicating with the press or members of the public on this topic in
>   the future...
> 
>   Except with regard to the importation of slaves after 1808, the
>   Constitution does not give Congress any authority to control
>   immigration (who enters one of the states), only naturalization (the
>   process of becoming a U.S. citizen). This is reflected by the fact that
>   for the first century or so of U.S. history (until 1875), there were no
>   federal statutes restricting entry to the United States (see
>   [3]https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_immigration_laws
>   ). Even today, being in the country without government permission is
>   considered by the authorities to be a civil offense, like getting a
>   parking ticket, not a criminal offense (see e.g.
>   [4]http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/mar/15/florida-con
>   ference-catholic-bishops/being-united-states-unlawfully-crime/).
> 
>   However, as the scope and power of the federal government expanded,
>   politicians felt less and less constrained by the Constitution and
>   began to increasingly stretch and violate it in various manners. Sadly,
>   government courts have largely acquiesced to most of these power grabs,
>   so most people today do not realize that like the federal anti-drug
>   laws, the federal regulation of products and services by myriad
>   agencies, the federal "ownership" of large tracts of land in many
>   states, etc., federal immigration laws are unconstitutional and
>   therefore illegal.
> 
>   Morally speaking, of course, it doesn't much matter whether a bad law
>   is "legal" or not. Plenty of horrific abuses committed by government
>   authorities throughout history have been perfectly legal according to
>   the laws enacted by themselves or their colleagues. But since many
>   people have been taught to automatically view the law as a good thing
>   (for an enlightening discussion of this, I highly recommend watching
>   the speech Larken Rose gave at an Independence Day rally a few years
>   ago, online at [5]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNWnBmoFiGQ), being
>   able to explain how you are not advocating lawbreaking when you stand
>   up for the rights of undocumented migrants, but in fact upholding the
>   highest law of the land, can be useful when when you are asked your
>   position on "enforcing the law", "illegal" immigration, etc.
> 
>   One final point ï¿½ you didn't say in your reply whether the reporter's
>   comments that you "argu(ed) that undocumented immigrants present
>   potential health and public safety problems" were also inaccurate, but
>   if you did say anything along those lines, I would strongly urge you to
>   avoid such comments in the future. Virtually anyone can be accurately
>   said to represent a potential public health or safety problem (you or I
>   might potentially get sick, or do something unsafe in public!), but the
>   law should never criminalize or discriminate against people on such
>   vague grounds ï¿½ no one should be detained without probable cause to
>   suspect that a particular individual poses a credible threat to public
>   health or safety. The mere fact of being undocumented does not make
>   anyone a threat to public health or safety.
> 
>   Good luck out there on the campaign trail, and don't forget that
>   electoral victory is only a small part of the battle ï¿½ your ability to
>   advance the cause of freedom as an elected official will largely depend
>   on your ability to articulate and defend the libertarian message to
>   your constituents and colleagues whose support you will need in order
>   to be an effective legislator and get pro-freedom changes enacted while
>   blocking attempts to expand the size, scope, cost, and power of
>   government!
> 
>   Love & Liberty,
> 
> 
> 
>                                      ((( starchild )))
> 
>   At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> 
>                           [6]RealReform at earthlink.net
> 
>                                    (415) 625-FREE
> 
>   P.S. ï¿½ I'm copying Florida LP member Ryan Ramsey on this email since he
>   wrote separately to members of the LNC regarding my initial message
>   about the Herald-Tribune article; I'll try to respond to him separately
>   later, but am behind on constituent email lately.
> 
>   On Jan 21, 2018, at 2:55 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
> 
>   Thank you Alison that is why I wanted to hear directly from you.
> 
>   Now go knock them dead.  Figuratively of course.
> 
>   -Caryn Ann
> 
>   On Sun, Jan 21, 2018 at 3:27 PM Alison Foxall
>   <[7]alison at foxallforflorida.com> wrote:
> 
>   To whom this may concern:
>   "Legislation that would punish local governments that donï¿½t fully
>   cooperate with federal immigration authorities drew support from
>   Libertarian Alison Foxall and criticism from Democrat Margaret Good..."
>   I never said I supported legislation to punish local governments.
>   Further, "drew support....and criticism" never happened because the
>   audience didn't clap for either candidate. The journalist, Zac
>   Anderson, definitely got those points wrong. He never directly quoted
>   me except when I said it was a hot-button issue and I don't know why
>   (continue reading to see why I said that).
>   I oppose the top-down approach from the state of FL forcing local
>   governments to enforce federal immigration laws. The GOP continues to
>   push this. Something to note: our local law enforcement and the
>   majority of our constituents here in Sarasota support legal immigration
>   and do not want their city or county turned into a haven for
>   "undocumented" peoples, so they have chosen to enforce federal laws.
>   As a candidate for FL state house representative, in my opinion, it is
>   wise to have a working relationship with existing local elected
>   officials and despite what happens in different areas of the country,
>   our Sherrif here in Sarasota is well-liked and supports the second
>   amendment and an armed citizenry. I support the Sherrif and the City
>   Councilï¿½ and ultimately the rest of the community's decision to enforce
>   the law. It is, after all, what the constituency wants and why the
>   Sherrif has been at his station, continuously elected for the last 10
>   years.
>   A question that often comes up, much more so than talking about the
>   issues, is "how will you work with the old guard in Tallahassee [the
>   Capital]?". Voters are legitimately considering how a Libertarian
>   Representative would work within the Republican majority and Democratic
>   minority. Voters are curious if I will be able to form alliances or
>   alienate myself in the House. Something they clearly don't want is
>   alienation.
>   Even though I support the decisions of my constituents and their own
>   local governance, I under no circumstance would vote at the state level
>   to make counties or cities enforce federal immigration laws. That is up
>   to local governments. In Florida, we have "home rule" laws and the
>   state should not be imposing their will onto local municipalities. It
>   is written in our state constitution. I would have very little to do
>   when it comes to immigration issues which is why it is not present on
>   my website. I've knocked on thousands of doors and out of all those
>   people I have spoken to, none have ever brought up immigration. None.
>   Sarasota does not face an "illegal" immigration "problem".
>   So, why was it asked at a League of Women voters event? Because the GOP
>   sent scare tactic mailers to almost all voters in the district in late
>   December to drum up voter turnout in a special election to vote against
>   the Democrat. They employed the same tactic early last year in a city
>   council election. The GOP lost. Badly. Since December when that first
>   mailer went out, immigration questions have only come up twice in
>   public appearances. The Democrats in Sarasota on the city council have
>   no interest in ceasing to enforce federal immigration laws, but the GOP
>   is blowing the issue out of proportion as if it's something they want.
>   Personally, I am not enthusiastic about the issue (neither are the
>   DEM's here) and it's not something I go around talking about to solicit
>   votes. My platform is largely economic and energy based, with
>   highlights about restoring rights to felons that have finished their
>   sentences and ending the drug war to help end the opioid crisis in our
>   area, as well as jumpstart a hemp industry in our state.
>   Sarasota is not like most places. 62% of its income comes from
>   dividends, interest, and social security payouts. That will tip you off
>   to the demographics here: older retirees. And when I say older, I mean
>   really older, from the Silent Generation. We have more deaths in
>   Sarasota than we do births. At least 10% of people here remember
>   growing up during the great depression. A third of the population grew
>   up and lived through WWII. Nearly everyone remembers the start of the
>   Cold War, the wonders of the new space program, and Kennedy's
>   assassination. People talk about some of these events as if they
>   happened just a few years ago. The things they care about are what I
>   care about. I'm trying to become their representative, after all.
>   The libertarian facebook firing squad is a distraction from our goal of
>   reducing government. We are nowhere near even my stepping stone dream
>   of very limited government. Immigration laws need massive reform at the
>   federal level and how we get there is not through me or the seat I'm
>   trying to win. I became a Libertarian in 2014 when Adrian Wyllie made
>   the call to change my party registration. At the time I was
>   non-partisan and a self-described anarcho-capitalist (hence the strong
>   platform about economic freedom). I believed that political parties
>   were a big part of the problems our country is facing and resisted
>   joining for some time. But after seeing the injustice of debate
>   exclusion that Wyllie faced in Florida, and the possibility of the
>   Libertarian Party becoming a major party by reaching 5% threshold of
>   registered voters, I took a leap of faith and joined "the collective"
>   of big-L Libertarians in Florida and I haven't looked back since. I
>   figured I might as well be a part of the change, instead of not
>   participating at all.
>   Our campaign has received a ridiculous amount of mainstream media
>   attention locally. TV and printed news is the preferred news
>   consumption platform for our audience, and we've gotten a lot of it.
>   Yesterday, the local news station came out to our canvassing assembly
>   before we hit the streets. I am meeting with TV, radio, and news
>   journalists every day this week. January 30th we will be in the
>   televised debates and it is anticipated to be one of the most watched
>   things on local television this year. I've attached some coverage that
>   ran in this mornings paper. My photo is front and center. The article
>   mentions we are a big wild card, campaigning aggressively, and could
>   draw significant support. These are the kindest things a news
>   journalist have said about a Libertarian campaign I've ever read about
>   in Florida. This is our chance to win.
>   I implore you all to help drum up support to win this seat instead of
>   hampering it. We have huge momentum here on the ground, and we've
>   already broken fundraising records for a FL Libertarian State House
>   campaign in a special election, and are about $1,800 away from breaking
>   the overall amount raised in any FL Libertarian State House campaign.
>   We are making history and smashing through records from nearly 15 years
>   ago. Libertarians in Florida are on the rise.
>   As this email took an absorbent amount of time to write, if you have
>   follow-up questions, please give me a call: 941-840-0369. My time needs
>   to be spent very wisely from now until election day on February 13th.
>   This is the home stretch, the culmination of months and thousands of
>   hours of work. I'm running to advance our movement, to grow our party,
>   and most of all to have Libertarian representation in our state. The
>   opportunity to win is dangling in front of us, ripe, and ready for the
>   taking. The question is: do you really want it as much as I do?
>   [f18dQhb0S7ks8dDMPbW2n0x6l2B9gXrN7sKj6v4dZ0vW4WJ4Tb3MPpWYN65jGX-d3_yKW9
>   jlCX31k1H6H0?si=4861442635857920&pi=0300150b-276f-4cc8-b606-39637f4
>   6a075&ti=undefined]
>   Thank you,
>   Alison Foxall
>   Libertarian Candidate for FL House District 72
>   Special Election, February 13th, 2018
>   Volunteer Today: [8]foxallforflorida.com/volunteer
> 
>   On Sat, Jan 20, 2018 at 2:01 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
>   <[9]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
> 
>   I would like to hear Alison's view.
> 
>   On Sat, Jan 20, 2018 at 12:06 AM, Starchild <[10]starchild at lp.org>
>   wrote:
> 
>> SARASOTA ï¿½ Legislation that would punish local governments that donï¿½t
>   fully cooperate with federal immigration authorities drew support from
>   Libertarian Alison Foxall and criticism from Democrat Margaret Good
>   during a candidate forum for the state House District 72 race Tuesday.
>> Foxall, a Sarasota marketing company owner, noted that the so-called
>   sanctuary cities bill ï¿½ which cleared the Florida House last week ï¿½ has
>   become ï¿½a very hot button issue.ï¿½
>> 
>> ï¿½I donï¿½t understand why,ï¿½ Foxall said in arguing that undocumented
>   immigrants present potential health and public safety problems.
>   (From
>   [11]http://www.heraldtribune.com/news/20180116/sarasota-state-house-can
>   didates-debate-immigration-guns-abortion-at-forum)
>           I can't find anything on Alison Foxall's website about
>   immigration one way or the other, and want to give her the benefit of
>   the doubt that the paper got it wrong. I've copied the candidate, who
>   is also a member of the Social Media Process Review Committee, on this
>   message so she can address what her local paper reported.
>           Hopefully we are not too preoccupied with policing intemperate
>   posts on Facebook to be concerned if a Libertarian candidate is taking
>   actual anti-libertarian positions at a public campaign event covered by
>   the media. Allison's campaign is currently being touted in an ad on the
>   front page of [12]LP.org.
>   Love & Liberty,
>                                      ((( starchild )))
>   At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>                                   [13]starchild at lp.org
>                                   (415) 625-FREE
> 
>     _______________________________________________
>     Lnc-business mailing list
>     [14]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>     [15]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
> 
> References
> 
>   1. http://floridapolitics.com/archives/248759-sanctuary-city-ban-bill-makes-comebac
>   2. mailto:zac.anderson at heraldtribune.com
>   3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_immigration_laws
>   4. http://www.politifact.com/florida/statements/2017/mar/15/florida-conference-catholic-bishops/being-united-states-unlawfully-crime/
>   5. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=YNWnBmoFiGQ
>   6. mailto:RealReform at earthlink.net
>   7. mailto:alison at foxallforflorida.com
>   8. http://foxallforflorida.com/volunteer
>   9. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>  10. mailto:starchild at lp.org
>  11. http://www.heraldtribune.com/news/20180116/sarasota-state-house-candidates-debate-immigration-guns-abortion-at-forum
>  12. http://LP.org/
>  13. mailto:starchild at lp.org
>  14. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>  15. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
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