[Lnc-business] Email Ballot 2018-03: Censure of Arvin Vohra
Daniel Hayes
daniel.hayes at lp.org
Wed Jan 31 04:35:09 EST 2018
Whoops...
Here comes another grievance. Someone was offended. This could get ridiculous. During our 4 years of infighting in La which pre-dated my involvement in the Party , during the last round of it there were 72 grievances submitted to our judicial committee. It was so fun and productive that I was thinking I needed to eat glass to reproduce euphoria of the experience. We are so lucky though because we seem to be devolving in that direction.
I don’t think Starchild intends to issue a grievance and is just making a point. That said this could get silly as I said.
I think it’s clear we need to tighten up the policy manual to avoid some “endless wars”.
Daniel Hayes
LNC At Large Member
Sent from my iPhone
> On Jan 30, 2018, at 11:29 PM, Starchild <starchild at lp.org> wrote:
>
>
> Caryn Ann,
>
> Mary Ruwart's comment is clearly weighing in on our debate on this motion, and her stance seems plain enough. It's hard to imagine she'd object to us seeing her remarks in a timely manner, so accusing Arvin of "using people" by publishing them here seems uncalled for. As does the use of demonizing epithets like "pervert". I frankly find that language offensive, and hope we can keep the discussion more civil.
>
> Love & Liberty,
>
> ((( starchild )))
> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> RealReform at earthlink.net
> (415) 625-FREE
>
>
>> On Jan 30, 2018, at 8:52 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>
>> And of course that was not the point.
>> I would love to speak with Dr. Ruwart on this, the author of "The
>> Compassion of Libertarianism" about how we need less empathy and ya
>> know, if a 14 year old gets pregnant, might as well be a pervert with a
>> job rather than a broke kid. Because welfare.
>> This is called using people.
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 30, 2018 at 8:56 PM, Arvin Vohra <[1]votevohra at gmail.com>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Forward from Dr. Mary Ruwart:
>> “If such motions had circulated in the LNC in the early days of
>> our
>> Party, no LNC member would have spoken out against the War on
>> Drugs,
>> claimed that gays had rights, or pointed out that taxation was
>> theft.
>> All of these positions were considered inflammatory and offensive
>> to
>> the majority of people outside the LP for most of the 1980s,
>> regardless
>> of how carefully these positions were presented. Now, they are
>> seriously embraced or considered across the political spectrum
>> precisely because we spoke out. It’s impossible to affect serious
>> change without offending some listeners. How can anyone believe
>> that
>> the LP supports free speech when its own members are punished for
>> engaging in it?” ----Mary J. Ruwart
>>
>> On Tue, Jan 30, 2018 at 3:45 AM, <[1][2]david.demarest at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>> I change my vote to "YES" on the censure motion and ask others to
>> vote 'YES' and request the cancellation of the electronic meeting
>> to
>> consider suspension.
>> Arvin has audaciously and courageously challenged us to stop
>> speaking in tongues about our Libertarian principles. He has
>> correctly identified the fact that the opposition does a better
>> job
>> of describing our policy and positions than we do. We need to step
>> up to the plate with equal courage and get us back on track toward
>> our shared goal of freedom.
>> It is time to end this game of Russian roulette that Ms. Mattson
>> has
>> aptly described as a circular firing squad, this
>> political-correctness nightmare of timidity before voters and
>> pandemic get-elected-itis at the expense of not only our
>> principles
>> but any semblance of rationality. We have done enough damage to
>> the
>> Libertarian cause. Let us cease this endless cycle of
>> self-destruction before we plunge ourselves into a death-spiral of
>> reworded censure motions.
>> Good grief - enough already!
>> ~David Pratt Demarest
>> On 2018-01-29 22:11, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>> I hope my statement that the censure will fail is disproven. I am
>> disappointed in the yes votes changing to no. This censure is
>> woefully
>> inadequate, but it is not as woefully inadequate as nothing at
>> all.
>> What we heard from Arvin is a defense of Trump tactics. That
>> is
>> not
>> the LP I work for, recruit for, and donate for.
>> On Mon, Jan 29, 2018 at 9:00 PM, Patrick McKnight
>>
>> <[1][2][3]patrick.mcknight at lp.org> wrote:
>> I vote yes. However I feel censure is insufficient and
>> look
>> forward to
>> the electronic meeting.
>> Thanks,
>> Patrick McKnight
>> Region 8 Rep
>> On Mon, Jan 29, 2018 at 10:21 PM, Tim Hagan
>> <[1][2][3][4]tim.hagan at lp.org>
>>
>> wrote:
>> I vote yes.
>> ---
>> Tim Hagan
>> Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
>> On 2018-01-20 19:03, Alicia Mattson wrote:
>> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by January 30,
>> 2018 at
>> 11:59:59pm Pacific time.
>> Co-Sponsors: Hayes, Hewitt, Demarest, Hagan
>> Motion: to censure LNC Vice Chair Arvin Vohra for
>> repeated
>> public
>> comments which have presented libertarian ideas in an
>> inflammatory
>> and
>> sometimes offensive manner not conducive to Libertarian
>> leaders and
>> candidates for public office winning hearts and minds
>> for
>> those
>> ideas.
>> -Alicia
>> _______________________________________________
>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>
>> [2][3][4][5]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> [3][4][5][6]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin
>> /mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> References
>> 1. mailto:[5][6][7]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 2. mailto:[6][7][8]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 3. [7][8][9]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/ma
>> ilman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> References
>> 1. mailto:[9][10]patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 2. mailto:[10][11]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 3. mailto:[11][12]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 4. [12][13]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/
>> mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 5. mailto:[13][14]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 6. mailto:[14][15]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 7. [15][16]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/
>> mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> --
>> Arvin Vohra
>> [16][17]www.VoteVohra.com
>> [17][18]VoteVohra at gmail.com
>> [19](301) 320-3634
>> References
>> 1. mailto:[20]david.demarest at lp.org
>> 2. mailto:[21]patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 3. mailto:[22]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 4. mailto:[23]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 5. [24]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 6. mailto:[25]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 7. mailto:[26]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 8. [27]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 9. mailto:[28]patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 10. mailto:[29]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 11. mailto:[30]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 12. [31]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 13. mailto:[32]tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 14. mailto:[33]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 15. [34]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 16. [35]http://www.VoteVohra.com/
>> 17. mailto:[36]VoteVohra at gmail.com
>>
>> References
>>
>> 1. mailto:votevohra at gmail.com
>> 2. mailto:david.demarest at lp.org
>> 3. mailto:patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 4. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 5. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 6. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin
>> 7. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 8. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 9. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/ma
>> 10. mailto:patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 11. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 12. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 13. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 14. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 15. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 16. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 17. http://www.VoteVohra.com/
>> 18. mailto:VoteVohra at gmail.com
>> 19. tel:(301) 320-3634
>> 20. mailto:david.demarest at lp.org
>> 21. mailto:patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 22. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 23. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 24. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 25. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 26. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 27. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 28. mailto:patrick.mcknight at lp.org
>> 29. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 30. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 31. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 32. mailto:tim.hagan at lp.org
>> 33. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> 34. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>> 35. http://www.VoteVohra.com/
>> 36. mailto:VoteVohra at gmail.com
>
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