[Lnc-business] Fwd: Judicial Committee motions
Caryn Ann Harlos
caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
Mon Jul 16 15:46:27 EDT 2018
All of that is correct and that is where principles of equity come into
play- the delegates never intended to have no JC. The JC protects them
against us. Arguably (it’s my position and not others) the reason they are
in this position is our fault.
Ergo principles of equity require an opportunity to redress.
Of course it’s not in the Bylaws - that is exactly what General Robert was
getting at - what to do in these kinds of situations.
Otherwise that’s a very neat trick by an LNC. Make sure there is no
protection.
It doesnt have to be purposeful- that’s the reality and *its our fault*
-Caryn Ann
On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 1:14 PM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
wrote:
> Why it's not able to happen:
>
> ---
> Libertarian Party Bylaws
> and Convention Rules
>
> ARTICLE 8: JUDICIAL COMMITTEE
>
> "...The Judicial Committee shall take office
> immediately upon the close of the Regular Convention at which elected
> and shall serve until the
> final adjournment of the next Regular Convention."
>
> ---> We currently have no Judicial Committee and it doesn't matter what
> the previous committee passes, they now have no authority in this
> matter.
>
> _________
>
> " The remaining members of
> the Judicial Committee shall appoint new members if vacancies occur,
> such appointees to serve
> until the final adjournment of the next Regular Convention"
>
> ---> Can't happen, as there's no JC to do any appointing.
> ______________
>
> ---> Nor, is there any provision for a mail ballot after the convention
> has adjourned. Nor, can the LNC follow a 1923 General Robert's book, as
> our bylaws state:
>
> ARTICLE 16: PARLIAMENTARY AUTHORITY
> The rules contained in the current edition of Robert's Rules of Order,
> Newly Revised shall govern the
> Party in all cases to which they are applicable and in which they are
> not inconsistent with these bylaws
> and any special rules of order adopted by the Party.
> _____________
>
> The delegate body at convention didn't suspend the rules for the JC
> election as it did for the At-Large. Our chair was even asked if the
> rules suspension would also apply to the JC, and the answer was no, it
> would not. (I'd have to watch the video for the exact language, but I
> was there and heard it, as did everyone paying attention who was there.
> This isn't an area of dispute)
>
> As the normal plurality of the At-Large elections would apply to the
> Judicial Committee, but rules weren't suspended for the JC, we're
> without a JC. We can't appoint them, as the bylaws say only someone one
> the JC can appoint. But, we have no JC. The previous committee was
> disbanded when the convention adjourned.
>
> EVH
>
> ---
> Elizabeth Van Horn
> LNC Region 3 (IN, MI, OH, KY)
> Secretary Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
> LP Social Media Process Review Committee
> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>
>
> On 2018-07-16 10:21, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
> > Please see the below communication from Chuck Moulton.
> >
> > Which brings to mind another way to handle. Since the maybe JC did
> > this outside of our direction - if we refer ratification of this to
> > the
> > delegates my mail - majority vote- we have as legitimate of JC that
> > we
> > are going to get.
> >
> > -Caryn Ann
> >
> > ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> > From: Chuck Moulton <[1]chuck at moulton.org>
> > Date: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:41 AM
> > Subject: Judicial Committee motions
> > To: Nick Sarwark <[2]chair at lp.org>, Caryn Ann Harlos
> > <[3]secretary at lp.org>
> > CC: D Frank Robinson <[4]dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com>, Chuck Moulton
> > <[5]chuck at moulton.org>, Darryl Perry <[6]Darryl at darrylwperry.com>,
> > Ruth
> > Bennett <[7]bennettruthaz at gmail.com>, Geoff Neale
> > <[8]liber8or at austin.rr.com>, Jim Turney <[9]LP at jimturney.com>,
> > Tricia
> > Sprankle <[10]tricia at spranklelaw.com>, Alicia Dearn
> > <[11]aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com>, William Hall
> > <[12]WHall at wnj.com>,
> > John Buttrick <[13]jabuttrick at gmail.com>, Rob Latham
> > <[14]freeutahns at gmail.com>, Michael Badnarik
> > <[15]scholar at constitutionpreservation.org>, Gary Johnson
> > <[16]sedition at aol.com>
> > Chuck Moulton wrote (7/6/2018 at 4:31 pm):
> > > Because no one received a majority vote with approval voting,
> > there
> > is a
> > > controversy as to whether the Judicial Committee was properly
> > elected.
> > >
> > > Without getting into details of the relative merits of each
> > > interpretation, I believe this is an exhaustive list:
> > >
> > > 1. The convention elected all 7 JC members by plurality (the
> > motion
> > to
> > > suspend the rules for at-large applies to JC because our rules say
> > the
> > > JC uses the same method of election as at-large).
> > >
> > > 2. The convention elected 5 JC members by plurality (the motion
> > > referenced above explicitly said the top 5 would be elected by
> > plurality)
> > >
> > > 3. The JC from the previous term continues serving another 2 or 4
> > years
> > > (no one received a majority)
> > >
> > > 4. The LNC can appoint the JC (the LNC can fill at-large
> > vacancies,
> > and
> > > our rules say the JC is elected by the same method as at-large)
> > >
> > > 5. We have no JC (no one received a majority and our bylaws say
> > the
> > JC
> > > serves until the final adjournment of the next convention rather
> > than
> > > when the next JC is elected)
> > >
> > > I can't do anything about interpretation #5.
> > >
> > > I am trying my best to at least make the interpretations in #1,
> > #2,
> > #3,
> > > and #4 be the same people so those with different interpretations
> > don't
> > > think we have 4 different JCs. I believe this will add to the
> > > legitimacy of the JC.
> > Mr. Chair and Ms. Secretary,
> > Please relay the following information to the Libertarian National
> > Committee. I write both on behalf of the 2016-2018 Judicial
> > Committee
> > and on behalf of the 2018-2020 Judicial Committee.
> > First (to harmonize #3 with #1), the Judicial Committee from the
> > 2016-2018 term (which consisted of Michael Badnarik, John Buttrick,
> > Alicia Dearn, Bill Hall, Gary E. Johnson, Rob Latham, and Chuck
> > Moulton
> > with Chuck Moulton serving as chair) passed the following motion by
> > email ballot with a vote of 6-0-1:
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
> > Committee
> > to fill the 6 vacancies created upon the resignations of 6 members
> > of
> > the Judicial Committee:
> > * D. Frank Robinson
> > * Darryl Perry
> > * Ruth Bennett
> > * Geoff Neale
> > * Jim Turney
> > * Tricia Sprankle
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > The following members of the old JC submitted letters of resignation
> > contingent on the motion passing:
> > * Alicia Dearn
> > * John Buttrick
> > * Bill Hall
> > * Rob Latham
> > * Michael Badnarik
> > Gary E. Johnson did not respond to emails, participate in the vote,
> > or
> > submit a letter of resignation. By phone he told me that he is not
> > on
> > the Judicial Committee. He also believes we have no JC this term.
> > Second (to harmonize #2 with #1), the Judicial Committee which was
> > arguably elected by plurality for the 2016-2018 term under the
> > interpretation that the top 5 (but not the top 7) were elected
> > (which
> > consisted of D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry, Ruth
> > Bennett, and Geoff Neale with Chuck Moulton serving as interim
> > chair)
> > passed the following motion by email ballot with a vote of 5-0-0:
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
> > Committee
> > to fill the 2 vacancies left on Judicial Committee (if such
> > vacancies
> > exist):
> > * Jim Turney
> > * Tricia Sprankle
> >
> > ----------------------------------------------------------------------
> > At this point we 7 (D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry,
> > Ruth
> > Bennett, Geoff Neale, Jim Turney, and Tricia Sprankle) plan to elect
> > a
> > committee chair and consider rules of appellate procedure to submit
> > to
> > the Libertarian National Committee by the 90 day deadline in bylaw
> > 8.3.
> > We realize that the JC election may still be a mess, but any
> > further
> > resolution is out of our hands. Therefore, we will proceed as if we
> > were legitimately elected in order to meet bylaws deadlines.
> > Chuck Moulton
> > Interim Chair, 2018-2020 LP Judicial Committee
> > Chair, 2016-2018 LP Judicial Committee
> >
> > --
> >
> > --
> > In Liberty,
> > Caryn Ann Harlos
> > Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
> > - [17]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
> > Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
> > A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
> > We defend your rights
> > And oppose the use of force
> > Taxation is theft
> >
> >
>
--
--
*In Liberty,*
*Caryn Ann Harlos*
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary - Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
*We defend your rights*
*And oppose the use of force*
*Taxation is theft*
-------------- next part --------------
All of that is correct and that is where principles of equity come into
play- the delegates never intended to have no JC. The JC protects them
against us. Arguably (it’s my position and not others) the reason they
are in this position is our fault.
Ergo principles of equity require an opportunity to redress.
Of course it’s not in the Bylaws - that is exactly what General Robert
was getting at - what to do in these kinds of situations.
Otherwise that’s a very neat trick by an LNC. Make sure there is no
protection.
It doesnt have to be purposeful- that’s the reality and *its our fault*
-Caryn Ann
On Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 1:14 PM Elizabeth Van Horn
<[1]elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org> wrote:
Why it's not able to happen:
---
Libertarian Party Bylaws
and Convention Rules
ARTICLE 8: JUDICIAL COMMITTEE
"...The Judicial Committee shall take office
immediately upon the close of the Regular Convention at which
elected
and shall serve until the
final adjournment of the next Regular Convention."
---> We currently have no Judicial Committee and it doesn't matter
what
the previous committee passes, they now have no authority in this
matter.
_________
" The remaining members of
the Judicial Committee shall appoint new members if vacancies occur,
such appointees to serve
until the final adjournment of the next Regular Convention"
---> Can't happen, as there's no JC to do any appointing.
______________
---> Nor, is there any provision for a mail ballot after the
convention
has adjourned. Nor, can the LNC follow a 1923 General Robert's
book, as
our bylaws state:
ARTICLE 16: PARLIAMENTARY AUTHORITY
The rules contained in the current edition of Robert's Rules of
Order,
Newly Revised shall govern the
Party in all cases to which they are applicable and in which they
are
not inconsistent with these bylaws
and any special rules of order adopted by the Party.
_____________
The delegate body at convention didn't suspend the rules for the JC
election as it did for the At-Large. Our chair was even asked if
the
rules suspension would also apply to the JC, and the answer was no,
it
would not. (I'd have to watch the video for the exact language, but
I
was there and heard it, as did everyone paying attention who was
there.
This isn't an area of dispute)
As the normal plurality of the At-Large elections would apply to the
Judicial Committee, but rules weren't suspended for the JC, we're
without a JC. We can't appoint them, as the bylaws say only someone
one
the JC can appoint. But, we have no JC. The previous committee was
disbanded when the convention adjourned.
EVH
---
Elizabeth Van Horn
LNC Region 3 (IN, MI, OH, KY)
Secretary Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
LP Social Media Process Review Committee
Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
[2]http://www.lpcaucus.org/
On 2018-07-16 10:21, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
> Please see the below communication from Chuck Moulton.
>
> Which brings to mind another way to handle. Since the maybe JC
did
> this outside of our direction - if we refer ratification of
this to
> the
> delegates my mail - majority vote- we have as legitimate of JC
that
> we
> are going to get.
>
> -Caryn Ann
>
> ---------- Forwarded message ---------
> From: Chuck Moulton <[1][3]chuck at moulton.org>
> Date: Mon, Jul 16, 2018 at 7:41 AM
> Subject: Judicial Committee motions
> To: Nick Sarwark <[2][4]chair at lp.org>, Caryn Ann Harlos
> <[3][5]secretary at lp.org>
> CC: D Frank Robinson <[4][6]dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com>, Chuck
Moulton
> <[5][7]chuck at moulton.org>, Darryl Perry
<[6][8]Darryl at darrylwperry.com>,
> Ruth
> Bennett <[7][9]bennettruthaz at gmail.com>, Geoff Neale
> <[8][10]liber8or at austin.rr.com>, Jim Turney
<[9][11]LP at jimturney.com>,
> Tricia
> Sprankle <[10][12]tricia at spranklelaw.com>, Alicia Dearn
> <[11][13]aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com>, William Hall
> <[12][14]WHall at wnj.com>,
> John Buttrick <[13][15]jabuttrick at gmail.com>, Rob Latham
> <[14][16]freeutahns at gmail.com>, Michael Badnarik
> <[15][17]scholar at constitutionpreservation.org>, Gary Johnson
> <[16][18]sedition at aol.com>
> Chuck Moulton wrote (7/6/2018 at 4:31 pm):
> > Because no one received a majority vote with approval voting,
> there
> is a
> > controversy as to whether the Judicial Committee was properly
> elected.
> >
> > Without getting into details of the relative merits of each
> > interpretation, I believe this is an exhaustive list:
> >
> > 1. The convention elected all 7 JC members by plurality (the
> motion
> to
> > suspend the rules for at-large applies to JC because our
rules say
> the
> > JC uses the same method of election as at-large).
> >
> > 2. The convention elected 5 JC members by plurality (the
motion
> > referenced above explicitly said the top 5 would be elected
by
> plurality)
> >
> > 3. The JC from the previous term continues serving another 2
or 4
> years
> > (no one received a majority)
> >
> > 4. The LNC can appoint the JC (the LNC can fill at-large
> vacancies,
> and
> > our rules say the JC is elected by the same method as
at-large)
> >
> > 5. We have no JC (no one received a majority and our bylaws
say
> the
> JC
> > serves until the final adjournment of the next convention
rather
> than
> > when the next JC is elected)
> >
> > I can't do anything about interpretation #5.
> >
> > I am trying my best to at least make the interpretations in
#1,
> #2,
> #3,
> > and #4 be the same people so those with different
interpretations
> don't
> > think we have 4 different JCs. I believe this will add to
the
> > legitimacy of the JC.
> Mr. Chair and Ms. Secretary,
> Please relay the following information to the Libertarian
National
> Committee. I write both on behalf of the 2016-2018 Judicial
> Committee
> and on behalf of the 2018-2020 Judicial Committee.
> First (to harmonize #3 with #1), the Judicial Committee from
the
> 2016-2018 term (which consisted of Michael Badnarik, John
Buttrick,
> Alicia Dearn, Bill Hall, Gary E. Johnson, Rob Latham, and Chuck
> Moulton
> with Chuck Moulton serving as chair) passed the following
motion by
> email ballot with a vote of 6-0-1:
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
> Committee
> to fill the 6 vacancies created upon the resignations of 6
members
> of
> the Judicial Committee:
> * D. Frank Robinson
> * Darryl Perry
> * Ruth Bennett
> * Geoff Neale
> * Jim Turney
> * Tricia Sprankle
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> The following members of the old JC submitted letters of
resignation
> contingent on the motion passing:
> * Alicia Dearn
> * John Buttrick
> * Bill Hall
> * Rob Latham
> * Michael Badnarik
> Gary E. Johnson did not respond to emails, participate in the
vote,
> or
> submit a letter of resignation. By phone he told me that he is
not
> on
> the Judicial Committee. He also believes we have no JC this
term.
> Second (to harmonize #2 with #1), the Judicial Committee which
was
> arguably elected by plurality for the 2016-2018 term under the
> interpretation that the top 5 (but not the top 7) were elected
> (which
> consisted of D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl Perry,
Ruth
> Bennett, and Geoff Neale with Chuck Moulton serving as interim
> chair)
> passed the following motion by email ballot with a vote of
5-0-0:
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> I move that the following people be appointed to the Judicial
> Committee
> to fill the 2 vacancies left on Judicial Committee (if such
> vacancies
> exist):
> * Jim Turney
> * Tricia Sprankle
>
>
--------------------------------------------------------------------
--
> At this point we 7 (D. Frank Robinson, Chuck Moulton, Darryl
Perry,
> Ruth
> Bennett, Geoff Neale, Jim Turney, and Tricia Sprankle) plan to
elect
> a
> committee chair and consider rules of appellate procedure to
submit
> to
> the Libertarian National Committee by the 90 day deadline in
bylaw
> 8.3.
> We realize that the JC election may still be a mess, but any
> further
> resolution is out of our hands. Therefore, we will proceed as
if we
> were legitimately elected in order to meet bylaws deadlines.
> Chuck Moulton
> Interim Chair, 2018-2020 LP Judicial Committee
> Chair, 2016-2018 LP Judicial Committee
>
> --
>
> --
> In Liberty,
> Caryn Ann Harlos
> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
> - [17]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
> We defend your rights
> And oppose the use of force
> Taxation is theft
>
>
--
--
In Liberty,
Caryn Ann Harlos
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
- [19]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
We defend your rights
And oppose the use of force
Taxation is theft
References
1. mailto:elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org
2. http://www.lpcaucus.org/
3. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
4. mailto:chair at lp.org
5. mailto:secretary at lp.org
6. mailto:dfrank_robinson at yahoo.com
7. mailto:chuck at moulton.org
8. mailto:Darryl at darrylwperry.com
9. mailto:bennettruthaz at gmail.com
10. mailto:liber8or at austin.rr.com
11. mailto:LP at jimturney.com
12. mailto:tricia at spranklelaw.com
13. mailto:aliciadearn at bellatrixlaw.com
14. mailto:WHall at wnj.com
15. mailto:jabuttrick at gmail.com
16. mailto:freeutahns at gmail.com
17. mailto:scholar at constitutionpreservation.org
18. mailto:sedition at aol.com
19. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
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