[Lnc-business] Email Ballot 2018-19: AGREE TO "JC" DECISIONS

Sam Goldstein sam.goldstein at lp.org
Tue Jul 31 13:01:24 EDT 2018 

Indeed, less trouble can be caused that way.  Much like state 
legislatures that only meet 30-60 days per year.

---
Sam Goldstein
Libertarian National Committee
317-850-0726 Cell

On 2018-07-31 11:57, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
> I tried to call an e-meeting.  But like last term it seems that
> meeting as few times as possible is what is desired.
> 
> -Caryn Ann
> 
> On Tue, Jul 31, 2018 at 9:47 AM, Sam Goldstein via Lnc-business
> <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>> So it just takes a majority of those voting to pass this motion which 
>> is
>> well less than 50% of the LNC at this time.   I think that would be a
>> horrible precedent to set, especially for such an important subject.
>> 
>> This is a very bad idea and should have been open to a debate at our 
>> next
>> meeting.  There is nothing urgent confronting the LNC at this point 
>> that
>> would require a pretend JC with no actual Bylaws authority or 
>> enforcement
>> ability.
>> 
>> Please vote No and let's talk about the situation next month.
>> 
>> Live Free,
>> 
>> 
>> ---
>> Sam Goldstein
>> Libertarian National Committee
>> 317-850-0726 Cell
>> 
>> On 2018-07-31 10:02, Tim Hagan via Lnc-business wrote:
>>> 
>>> I vote yes.
>>> 
>>> In practice this is very similar to the idea of an Appeals Committee.
>>> Seems to be the best solution to the situation that the convention
>>> delegates created.
>>> 
>>> ---
>>> Tim Hagan
>>> Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
>>> 
>>> On 2018-07-31 04:58, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> 
>>>> REMINDER - This ballot will expire on AUGUST 1, 2018.
>>>> 
>>>> I have noted the following (please inform me of any corrections):
>>>> 
>>>> Voting AYE: Harlos, Longstreth, Merced, Nekhaila, Olsen, Phillips
>>>> 
>>>> Voting NAY: Goldstein, Lyons
>>>> 
>>>> Express Abstentions: None
>>>> 
>>>> Not Voting: Bilyeu/Adams, Bishop-Henchman, Hagan, Lark/Hogarth,
>>>> Mattson, Redpath, Sarwark, Smith, Van Horn/Nanna
>>>> 
>>>> For a current tally of 6-2.
>>>> 
>>>> Notes: Region 8 Representative Hewitt has not voted so Alternate
>>>> Olsen's vote stands.
>>>> 
>>>> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes here:
>>>> https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>>> 
>>>> On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 1:09 PM, Jeff Lyons via Lnc-business
>>>> <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>> On 2018-07-25 20:40, Alex Merced (LNC Vice Chair) via Lnc-business
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> I vote yes, from my understanding this does not appoint them as 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> judicial committee which if successfully elected by delegates we’d 
>>>>>> be
>>>>>> bound to follow.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Instead this just says the LNC will voluntarily bind itself to the
>>>>>> decisions of the top 7 vote getters in matters in which a JC would
>>>>>> operate.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> This seems to me an effort to self-regulate in a spirit that Best
>>>>>> represents an effort to represent the wishes of the delegation to 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> extent such can be discernible with the existing votes.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> This motion does not say they are the JC but just that we will 
>>>>>> hold
>>>>>> their deliberations voluntarily binding in same way we’d be
>>>>>> mandatorily bound had they’d successfully been elected.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> An unfortunate compromise, but the best one I’ve seen. It isn’t 
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> LNC Creating new powers but voluntarily putting a back stop on its
>>>>>> existing ones temporarily since no other backstops exist formally 
>>>>>> for
>>>>>> the time being.
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Alex Merced
>>>>>> Vice Chair of the Libertarian National Committee/LP
>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Jul 25, 2018, at 2:12 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
>>>>>>> <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> It is better than having zero protection at all for the members.  
>>>>>>> And
>>>>>>> IF after making this agreement, anyone who voted to then renege I
>>>>>>> would hope would not be re-elected.  This "JC" has already 
>>>>>>> submitted
>>>>>>> it appellate rules.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> Our Party structure NEVER imagined an unaccountable LNC.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 12:05 PM, Sam Goldstein
>>>>>>>> <sam.goldstein at lp.org>
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote No on this motion.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 1. The Bylaws are clear that only delegates at convention can 
>>>>>>>> elect
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> Judicial Committee
>>>>>>>> 2. The Top Seven mentioned in this motion were not approved by
>>>>>>>> margins
>>>>>>>> of at
>>>>>>>> least 60% of the
>>>>>>>>   delegates so would not meet the precedent set by the last JC 
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> requiring
>>>>>>>> a majority approval of delegates
>>>>>>>> 3. There is no provision in either the Bylaws or Policy Manual 
>>>>>>>> of how
>>>>>>>> this
>>>>>>>> pretend JC would function, whether it
>>>>>>>>   would follow Appellate rules set by the last JC or would dream 
>>>>>>>> up
>>>>>>>> its'
>>>>>>>> own rules that this motion would
>>>>>>>>   have the LNC be bound to follow
>>>>>>>> 4. This has essentially already been rejected by the LNC per the
>>>>>>>> motion
>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>> recognize the Top Seven as the JC (which I voted
>>>>>>>>   in favor of but have reconsidered)
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Please consider my points before you vote on this motion.  The 
>>>>>>>> entire
>>>>>>>> purpose of the Judicial Committee is to have a body
>>>>>>>> that is not beholden to the LNC.  There is no guarantee that if 
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> pretend
>>>>>>>> JC makes a decision objectionable to the LNC that
>>>>>>>> the LNC cannot just reverse this motion by a majority vote.
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> ---
>>>>>>>> Sam Goldstein
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> 317-850-0726 Cell
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On 2018-07-25 13:23, Craig Bowden via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Yes
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Craig Bowden
>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Alternate
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> On 2018-07-25 06:06, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> We have an electronic mail ballot. Votes are due to the
>>>>>>>>>> LNC-Business
>>>>>>>>>>   list by AUGUST 1, 2018 at 11:59:59pm Pacific time. 
>>>>>>>>>> Co-Sponsors:
>>>>>>>>>> Harlos,
>>>>>>>>>>   Longstreth, Merced, Phillips Motion: Move that the 
>>>>>>>>>> Libertarian
>>>>>>>>>> National
>>>>>>>>>>   Committee agree to be bound by the decisions of the 
>>>>>>>>>> top-seven
>>>>>>>>>>   vote-getters for the Judicial Committee at the 2018 
>>>>>>>>>> Convention as
>>>>>>>>>> if
>>>>>>>>>>   they were elected in the normal course of convention 
>>>>>>>>>> business and
>>>>>>>>>>   follow the procedures and rules set forth in our Bylaws. It 
>>>>>>>>>> is
>>>>>>>>>>   acknowledged that this agreement is not binding upon any 
>>>>>>>>>> member
>>>>>>>>>> or
>>>>>>>>>>   affiliate. You can keep track of the Secretary's manual 
>>>>>>>>>> tally of
>>>>>>>>>> votes
>>>>>>>>>>   here: [1]https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>>>>>>>>>   --
>>>>>>>>>>   In Liberty,
>>>>>>>>>>   Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>>>>>>>   Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee 
>>>>>>>>>> Secretary -
>>>>>>>>>>   [2]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>>>>>>   Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>>>>>   A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>>>>>>>>   We defend your rights
>>>>>>>>>>   And oppose the use of force
>>>>>>>>>>   Taxation is theft
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>> References
>>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>>>   1. https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>>>>>>>>>   2. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> In Liberty,
>>>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>>>>> We defend your rights
>>>>>>> And oppose the use of force
>>>>>>> Taxation is theft
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> I could get behind this solution, once we ensure this never happens
>>>>> again.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> --
>>>>> In Liberty,
>>>>> Jeff Lyons
>>>>> 
>>>>> Region 8 Alternate
>>>>> (Acting Region 8 Rep)
>>>>> 
>>>>> Libertarian Assoc. of MA
>>>>> Membership Director
>>>>> http://www.lpmass.org/join
>>>>> 
>>>>> Daniel Fishman for Auditor
>>>>> Campaign Manager
>>>>> http://www.AuditMassachusetts.com
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> --
>>>> --
>>>> In Liberty,
>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>> 
>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>> We defend your rights
>>>> And oppose the use of force
>>>> Taxation is theft
> 
> 
> 
> --

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