[Lnc-business] The Purging of Alex Jones

Fri Aug 10 16:31:09 EDT 2018

Joe your email showed up garbled on the piper mail list.

-Caryn Ann

On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 11:42 AM, Craig Bowden <craig.bowden at lp.org> wrote:

> I'm not saying you did. I am saying we have to be careful about that
> perception coming across.
>
> Craig Bowden
> Region 1 Alterate
>
>
> On 2018-08-10 00:51, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>
>> Nothing I said implied force.
>>
>> On Fri, Aug 10, 2018 at 12:33 AM Craig Bowden <craig.bowden at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> My opinion doesn't change, regardless of what is being censored
>>> based on
>>> terms agreed to. And as I said, we can certainly state that we
>>> disagree
>>> with actions a company takes. That is the purview of our own speech
>>> that
>>> can be used. Just as I didn't like that the cake baker refused
>>> service,
>>> I do not want government to do anything about it. The answer is that
>>> we
>>> can voice displeasure. We can boycott. We can create alternatives in
>>> the
>>> market. We can encourage others to take money elsewhere. We can
>>> encourage selling off the stocks of a company.
>>>
>>> That is how you handle a situation like this. As a political party,
>>> however, when we speak, we must be careful. The reason we must be
>>> careful, is that when we take a position, it can be seen as this is
>>> how
>>> we would govern, or how we would make laws. So any statement must be
>>>
>>> carefully made, if at all, on this sort of issue.
>>>
>>> You do not want the appearance that we are advocating for government
>>> to
>>> force or regulate this sort of thing.
>>>
>>> So if the party is going to take a stance on this, I personally
>>> would
>>> have to see language on it before I could get behind it. The last
>>> thing
>>> I want is more perception that we would like to force the baking of
>>> a
>>> cake.
>>>
>>> Regards,
>>> Craig Bowden
>>> Region 1 Alternate
>>>
>>> On 2018-08-09 22:58, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>>
>>>> ====We can certainly dislike private censorship, but at the end of
>>>>
>>> the
>>>
>>>> day,
>>>> since it was not government, the best we can do is say that we
>>>> disagree
>>>>
>>>> with what those social media platforms did.===
>>>>
>>>> Make the issue about race, gender, or war and insert that
>>>>
>>> conclusion
>>>
>>>> above and ask if we would have the same opinion.
>>>>
>>>> We wouldn’t.
>>>>
>>>> The issue isn’t if private organizations have the right to do
>>>> something - of course they do.  The issue is whether it is right
>>>>
>>> to do
>>>
>>>> so.  We have never only stood on the side of rights we have also
>>>>
>>> stood
>>>
>>>> on the side of right - and the instrinsic value of open speech in
>>>>
>>> an
>>>
>>>> arena where it should be expected (unlike church and more like a
>>>>
>>> stage
>>>
>>>> for rent) is one of those things that are necessarily to prevent a
>>>> corporate dystopia which is just as destructive to human freedom
>>>>
>>> as a
>>>
>>>> state one.
>>>>
>>>> We can’t pretend as if we only take absolutely thin libertarian
>>>> stances because we don’t.
>>>>
>>>> A huge criticism of libertarianism is that we seem to act like
>>>>
>>> only
>>>
>>>> government can be bad actors and that private action is at worst
>>>> neutral.  And that is rightly rejected as being very naive.
>>>>
>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Aug 9, 2018 at 9:12 PM Craig Bowden <craig.bowden at lp.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> My statement on the issue was already done during a radio
>>>>>
>>>> interview
>>>
>>>> the
>>>>> other day. While I certainly don't appreciate people using
>>>>>
>>>> certain
>>>
>>>> type
>>>>> of language or twisting the truth, etc. they should be able to do
>>>>> so.
>>>>> However, if a platform decides that a person is violating their
>>>>> terms of
>>>>> service, which the user agreed to, it becomes a matter of
>>>>>
>>>> contract.
>>>
>>>> We
>>>>> can certainly dislike private censorship, but at the end of the
>>>>>
>>>> day,
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> since it was not government, the best we can do is say that we
>>>>> disagree
>>>>> with what those social media platforms did.
>>>>>
>>>>> I personally have zero support for Mr. Jones, but also don't mind
>>>>>
>>>> if
>>>
>>>> he
>>>>> does what he does. It doesn't affect me one way or the other. On
>>>>>
>>>> the
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> side of caution, I would say that we would need to know actual
>>>>>
>>>> facts
>>>
>>>> on
>>>>> why he was taken down. Was it due to repeated violations of terms
>>>>>
>>>> of
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> use? If so, I wouldn't say a dang word, because he clicked
>>>>>
>>>> accept.
>>>
>>>>
>>>>> If I were to go in front of my church and start talking about the
>>>>> glory
>>>>> of Satan, I would get shut down immediately. Why? Because I don't
>>>>> have
>>>>> freedom of speech at that pulpit. By entering the building, I
>>>>>
>>>> agree
>>>
>>>> that
>>>>> I will abide by the rules of the church. It is the same with
>>>>>
>>>> social
>>>
>>>> media platforms. That is the building, if the terms are violated,
>>>>> after
>>>>> being agreed to, that is on the person going against those terms.
>>>>>
>>>>> Craig Bowden
>>>>> Region 1 Representative
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2018-08-09 12:21, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> Is the LP going to issue an opinion on this?  It is the perfect
>>>>>> opportunity to affirm rights while showing that rights are not
>>>>>>
>>>>> the
>>>
>>>> end
>>>>>
>>>>>> all and be all to a healthy society.  A society of peaceful
>>>>>>
>>>>> bigots
>>>
>>>> -
>>>>>
>>>>>> for instance - is a sick society. So is a society that
>>>>>> paternalistically protects us all from "those unfit to speak".
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Whether or not they are *allowed* to do it misses the point.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> IN LIBERTY,
>>>>>> CARYN ANN HARLOS
>>>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>
>>>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>>>> _We defend your rights_
>>>>>> _And oppose the use of force_
>>>>>> _Taxation is theft_
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>
>>>> IN LIBERTY,
>>>> CARYN ANN HARLOS
>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>
>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>> _We defend your rights_
>>>> _And oppose the use of force_
>>>> _Taxation is theft_
>>>>
>>>  --
>>
>> IN LIBERTY,
>> CARYN ANN HARLOS
>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>
>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> _We defend your rights_
>> _And oppose the use of force_
>> _Taxation is theft_
>>
>
>

-- 
*In Liberty,*
*Caryn Ann Harlos*
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary - Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org

A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
*We defend your rights*
*And oppose the use of force*
*Taxation is theft*
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