[Lnc-business] Proposed

Sun Jul 7 02:28:23 EDT 2019

Of course that will continue to be your response.   

Meanwhile, don't make accusations/assumptions about the efforts of our
new ED. (blindsided, etc)  

As he's been transparent with his idea, and nothing's actually happened
except people discussing.

---
Elizabeth Van Horn
LNC Region 3 (IN, MI, OH, KY)
Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
http://www.lpcaucus.org/ 

On 2019-07-07 02:03, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:

> Everyone can go back and read the discussions.  Your representations are incorrect. 
> 
> That will continue to be my response.  It will be interesting to see your response to this situation.   
> 
> On Sat, Jul 6, 2019 at 11:28 PM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org> wrote: 
> 
>> Incorrect.
>> 
>> There was no 'made level".  There was an effort to mollify after the 
>> fact.  Which had stipulations where an LNC could only get T-shirts equal 
>> to the amount they'd donated to the LP within a certain recent time 
>> period. Which, conveniently included the time period when you acquired 
>> your lifetime membership. Even those who already had lifetime 
>> memberships, would've had to suddenly cough-up a significant amount of 
>> money to partake in the deal, at the level you were set-up for.  But, 
>> the T-shirts are the least of the issue.
>> 
>> Convention season was already well underway by the time the LNC found 
>> out you'd been having your travel to conventions reimbursed.  There's no 
>> way to retroactively level that past action.
>> 
>> As for no one else taking advantage. It should never have been approved. 
>> Others on the LNC also stated they didn't think the set-up should've 
>> been approved.  Of course, no one took Wes up on it.  It was wrong.
>> 
>> -----------------------------------------------
>> 
>> My point is, that you brought-up your past situation.  You did it your 
>> effort to paint what our new ED suggested and how he suggested it, as 
>> something wrong.
>> 
>> Although, our new ED has gone above-board bringing his suggestion to the 
>> publicly accessible LNC email list.  Contrary to the incident involving 
>> you and our past ED.
>> 
>> _______________________________________________
>> 
>> If you think our ED's suggestion isn't good, try arguing from the point 
>> of the merits of the suggested idea.  Not by attacking how the idea was 
>> brought to the public email list, which was a clear effort to be 
>> transparent and involve the LNC.
>> 
>> ---
>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>> 
>> On 2019-07-06 23:08, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>> Elizabeth, everyone can go re-read the discussions for themselves.  
>>> Your
>>> characterization is not accurate.
>>> 
>>> I think we can both agree without arguing that a paid salary is world's
>>> above membership t-shirts that were made open to everyone (and as far 
>>> as I
>>> am aware no one took Wes up on it).  This is by nature completely 
>>> unique
>>> and cannot be made level.
>>> 
>>> -Caryn Ann
>>> 
>>> On Sat, Jul 6, 2019 at 8:36 PM Daniel Fishman via Lnc-business <
>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> One of my long range goals is a permanently paid chair for the LP. It 
>>>> was
>>>> further down my agenda list, and I had presumed it would happen when 
>>>> we had
>>>> greater financial stability. When the opportunity presented itself now
>>>> though, I decided to try it out. And that means if it works we are 
>>>> talking
>>>> about the same option for whomever the chair is (and we've never 
>>>> elected a
>>>> chair to a 4th terms as far as I'm aware).
>>>> 
>>>> Of course a permanently paid chair is a convention level decision, but 
>>>> one
>>>> that can only be made if we can indeed afford it. Getting the 
>>>> financial
>>>> legs to stand on is what you brought me here for.
>>>> 
>>>> I'm a big believer in not being afraid to fail. In order to not fear
>>>> failure you must have metrics that can tell you if you are failing. 
>>>> This is
>>>> a pretty clear cut one. Any fundraising contractor will be expect to 
>>>> be
>>>> raising enough to cover their costs within a few months. And that 
>>>> includes
>>>> the Chair. If they can't, that's gets deemed a fail. We terminate the
>>>> experiment, learn from our mistakes and proceed to the next attempt.
>>>> 
>>>> To me this seems like a good roll of the dice, with relatively minimum 
>>>> risk
>>>> to the LNC. Almost all of the risk is borne by the Chair. I am asking 
>>>> to
>>>> put the Chair on the hot seat. Should any chair be contracted as a
>>>> fundraiser for the LNC and fail, the ramifications would reverberate 
>>>> till
>>>> the next convention. Should the chair succeed he benefits every future 
>>>> LNC
>>>> chair and future LNC by establishing the precedent that (I hope) will 
>>>> lead
>>>> the delegates to approving a permanently paid chair. I have 
>>>> essentially
>>>> asked the chair to put his head on the chopping block.
>>>> 
>>>> And it should be pointed out too Mr. Chair, that when I asked you if 
>>>> you
>>>> would be amenable you suggested I bring the idea to the LNC first. I 
>>>> have
>>>> done so, but you still have not actually indicated that you would 
>>>> indeed
>>>> accept the contract. I'm assuming you have been seeking counsel of 
>>>> your
>>>> own? Are you prepared to firmly commit to accepting a contract should 
>>>> one
>>>> be offered?
>>>> 
>>>> The chair is in a unique position to do things that will affect
>>>> fundraising, such as media appearances, published articles. As such 
>>>> the
>>>> unique position is one I think the LNC should try paying for to see if 
>>>> it
>>>> increases our revenue.
>>>> 
>>>> ---
>>>> Daniel Fishman
>>>> Executive Director
>>>> The Libertarian Party
>>>> Join Us <http://www.lp.org/join>
>>>> 
>>>> 
>>>> On Sat, Jul 6, 2019 at 3:45 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>> 
>>>>> It is already all of our jobs to fundraise.  Pay expenses? Certainly.
>>>>> Salary?  No.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I volunteer - expenses only.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Seriously after the shitstorm last year for legitimate fundraising it's
>>>> all
>>>>> of a sudden different because it's Nick and with salary?  I was in danger
>>>>> of (ridiculously) of bribing votes with t-shirts but this is okay?
>>>>> 
>>>>> Is Nick re-running?  Would there be no using of a salaried position to
>>>>> influence internal politics?
>>>>> 
>>>>> I'll say it right now, then every chair candidate must be given equal
>>>>> opportunity.
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Sat, Jul 6, 2019 at 12:20 PM John Phillips via Lnc-business <
>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> I think other people said that more recently than I, its been a few
>>>>> months
>>>>>> since I did 😂, tho I hinted at it.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Well thought out as always.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> John Phillips
>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
>>>>>> Cell 217-412-5973
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Jul 6, 2019 12:59 PM, Joe Bishop-Henchman via Lnc-business <
>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I guess Mr. Fishman's honeymoon period is over!
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I'm willing to hear out our ED and not shoot it down immediately, but
>>>>>> for my part I will need a lot more details when we consider it. If
>>>> we're
>>>>>> hiring a contractor, I want to know precisely what tasks the contractor
>>>>>> will be doing on at least a quarterly basis if not a monthly or weekly
>>>>>> basis, and how (and who) will be actively monitoring progress and
>>>>>> adjusting based on the results.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I will also need to review the information addressing whether this
>>>>>> violates the Bylaws or common past understandings of the role of the
>>>>>> Chair or LNC members.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> This contractor-who-knows-us approach would be preferable, in my view,
>>>>>> to hiring a commission fundraiser who knows little about us and
>>>>>> therefore will be ineffective at securing major donors willing to
>>>> invest
>>>>>> long-term with us. In-person telemarketing, which is effectively what
>>>>>> that is, can be effective for raising money quickly, but only at
>>>>>> enormous expense (as a percent of dollar raised), great risk of
>>>>>> misrepresentation, and at the expense of a continuing relationship.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Ideally we need to construct a fundraising department, essentially from
>>>>>> scratch now. We have two main donor audiences - major donors and small
>>>>>> dollar donors - and each of them needs attention as to their
>>>>>> prospecting/qualification/opening doors, asking/closing, and
>>>>>> stewardship/cultivation. That's essentially six completely different
>>>>>> skills (2 audiences times 3 jobs each) and we can't have one person do
>>>>>> all of it and expect them to do better than Lauren could. We also can't
>>>>>> hire six people, so the answer is going to be a mix of LNC members, the
>>>>>> ED, staff, and contractors.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> If we're going to get to a place where we are raising millions of
>>>>>> dollars or more each year, building a fundraising department is an
>>>>>> essential second step. (The first step is doing exciting things donors
>>>>>> want to support, or at least proposing to focus on those things. On
>>>> that
>>>>>> part, I'd like to invite Apollo to the next Board meeting and tell us
>>>>>> what he has up his sleeves.) If what Mr. Fishman proposes is a step in
>>>>>> that direction, I'm more inclined to support it. If not, not.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> As Mr. Phillips I think noted, if we say no to everything and propose
>>>>>> nothing we will quickly realize in a bad way how important fundraising
>>>>>> is.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> JBH
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ------------
>>>>>> Joe Bishop-Henchman
>>>>>> LNC Member (At-Large)
>>>>>> joe.bishop-henchman at lp.org
>>>>>> www.facebook.com/groups/189510455174837 [1]
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On 2019-07-05 16:50, John Phillips via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>> > Then lets get hiring.
>>>>>>
>>>>> 

Links:
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[1] http://www.facebook.com/groups/189510455174837