[Lnc-business] Seeking cosponsors - convention motion

[Caryn Ann Harlos]

That’s a potential betterment but that’s not a deliberative assembly.

On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 6:51 AM <joe.bishop-henchman at lp.org> wrote:

> I'm also on the state chairs list and the frustration being expressed is
> the voting in the test system is *too* centralized, with a stated
> preference that the votes on everything go through delegation chairs to
> ensure everyone's vote is counted.
>
> On May 14, 2020 8:37 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
> Mr. Nanna, I am reading the state chair's list.  It is not presently
> acceptable to them.  The shining ray of hope is that they look like they
> are willing to tell us to take our procedure and shove it and work it out
> for themselves.  Localization is better in this party too.  But the fact
> that the rest of the party is happy with this is a fiction.
>
> *In Liberty,*
>
> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
>
>
>
> On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 6:23 AM Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
>
> wrote:
>
> > I disagree with your assessment and that’s okay.  Last night’s test
> caused
> > even more issues and the comments and hostilities over that made me
> disable
> > Facebook.
> >
> > This online convention scheme is going to create a division far worse
> than
> > Portland.  Ten years from now it will still be going.
> >
> > There is only one thing I know we can do well.  Simple ballotting.
> >
> > But whatever happens happens.
> >
> > But I can’t support this gross violation of members rights and trading
> > rights for peace is an abdication.
> >
> > If this suicide route is what the LNC chooses, it has the right to do
> so.
> > To claim it us for peace is a farce I won’t let go unchallenged.
> >
> > If it happens I will do my best to minimize rights violations that I can
> > by making things smoother.
> >
> > But to sell member rights and call it peace is something you can tell
> > yourself.  I can’t.
> >
> > I can only hope states take the bull by the horns and plan to protect
> > their own member rights the best they can.
> >
> > On Thu, May 14, 2020 at 5:44 AM Alex Merced (LNC Vice Chair) via
> > Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >
> >> I second the exact sentiments from Representative O’Donnell, we should
> >> work to honor the compromise and I will vote against any move towards
> any
> >> extreme one way or the other.
> >>
> >> With such limited time it’s logistically unclear whether an all online
> >> convention could be sufficiently executed and with ballot access
> >> considerations and uncertainty in Orlando it is unwise to leave the
> P/VP
> >> nominations to July.
> >>
> >> Let’s honor the compromise, the hostility among this body is becoming
> too
> >> much of a distraction to members who could otherwise be organizing,
> >> campaigning and doings things other than being frustrated and confused
> by
> >> the uncertainty those who want either extreme are creating.
> >>
> >> Let’s create certainty for our members by honoring the compromise.
> >>
> >> Alex Merced
> >> Vice Chair of the Libertarian National Committee/LP
> >>
> >> > On May 14, 2020, at 12:35 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >> >
> >> > I will co-sponsor.  I want to give my reasons.  The chair is
> >> subverting the
> >> > will of the LNC, and the LNC needs to take back its rightful control
> of
> >> its
> >> > own decisions.  I do not know if I am going to vote for it.  But it
> >> needs
> >> > to be heard.
> >> >
> >> > If a concurrent motion is offered to have an acceptable compromise, I
> >> will
> >> > definitely vote for this.  But without such I do not know my answer.
> >> But I
> >> > will co-sponsor as a sign of my objection to the usurping of the
> >> authority
> >> > of the LNC by one person.
> >> >
> >> > *In Liberty,*
> >> >
> >> > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >> > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> > communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> anyone
> >> > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >> faux
> >> > pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >
> >> >> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 10:28 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >> Mr. Phillips we can concurrently offer the Adams compromise that
> would
> >> be
> >> >> a ballot that expires concurrently with this one or one day later.
> >> >>
> >> >> *In Liberty,*
> >> >>
> >> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> anyone
> >> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >> faux
> >> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >>
> >> >> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 10:28 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> >> >> wrote:
> >> >>
> >> >>> EVH, I think your point has merit.  If this motion passes, I
> >> >>> would re-offer the Erin Adams compromise motion or something very
> >> similar
> >> >>> unless someone convinces me that would be unwise.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> From what I hear from what happened tonight - not the things that
> >> will be
> >> >>> fixed with practices - but with the inherent flaws that make this
> NOT
> >> a
> >> >>> deliberative process and our chair's comments about points of order
> >> and
> >> >>> parliamentary inquiry, I do not believe we can pull this off and
> >> protect
> >> >>> rights.  If that is the route the LNC decides to take, I will
> respect
> >> it
> >> >>> and do my best, but the best at impossible is still impossible.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> But we did commit to a compromise.  But our compromise where our
> chair
> >> >>> has vowed to skuttle it is no compromise.  We need one that cannot
> be
> >> >>> skuttled by the chair.  Ms. Adams' compromise is far superior.
> After
> >> >>> getting some advise, I may be seeking co-sponsors for a concurrent
> >> ballot
> >> >>> with this one to expire after it that would adopt the Adams motion.
> >> >>>
> >> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >> >>>
> >> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >> anyone
> >> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> social
> >> faux
> >> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>>
> >> >>> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 10:23 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >> >>> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
> >> >>>
> >> >>>> Email ballots do not require four co-sponsors from the winning
> side.
> >> >>>> The sponsors are like seconds.   I have not decided if I am going
> to
> >> >>>> support this motion, but I am not going to let it get squashed by
> >> >>>> procedure.  But you are incorrect on the point of order to begin
> >> with.  We
> >> >>>> are not in the same session. That requirement for the winning side
> >> is only
> >> >>>> in the same session.  A rescind does not require someone on the
> >> winning
> >> >>>> side.  If you need the RONR pages, I can provide them.
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> *In Liberty,*
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >> Syndrome
> >> >>>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> >>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >> anyone
> >> >>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> social
> >> faux
> >> >>>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>> On Wed, May 13, 2020 at 9:48 PM justin.odonnell--- via
> Lnc-business <
> >> >>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >> >>>>
> >> >>>>> I object to this motion.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> The purpose of the compromise we came to was to accomodate ballot
> >> >>>>> access deadlines and the recognition that a July date made doing
> so
> >> >>>>> impossible or impractical. Ignoring those concerns is
> irresponsible
> >> and
> >> >>>>> damaging to the Party. Furthermore, we waited too long to make a
> >> decision
> >> >>>>> in the first place, this is on us. We all knew well before last
> >> weekend
> >> >>>>> that Memorial Day in Texas wasn't going to fly in the current
> >> climate, we
> >> >>>>> have noone but ourselves to blame for letting things get to this
> >> point with
> >> >>>>> wishful thinking. Its time to stop acting childish, suck it up,
> and
> >> make
> >> >>>>> the best of the situation we're in.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> On parliamentary grounds, a motion to reconsider is required to
> be
> >> made
> >> >>>>> by a member of the prevailing side, I would argue that an email
> >> ballot
> >> >>>>> requires 4 valid cosponsors, and thus would require 4 members
> from
> >> the
> >> >>>>> prevailing side to cosponsor in order to be a valid motion.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Justin O'Donnell
> >> >>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> On May 13, 2020 11:04 PM, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business <
> >> >>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> I ask for email ballot co-sponsors for the following motion to:
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Rescind in its entirety the motion adopted during the May 9, 2020
> >> LNC
> >> >>>>> meeting, which called for a convention to begin on May 22, 2020
> with
> >> >>>>> business conducted online.  Instead, in accordance with Bylaw
> >> Article
> >> >>>>> 10.1,
> >> >>>>> the LNC calls an in-person convention to occur during the dates
> of
> >> July
> >> >>>>> 8-12, 2020 at Rosen Shingle Creek in Orlando, Florida.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> I know that I was on the losing side of a 13-4 motion on
> Saturday,
> >> >>>>> however
> >> >>>>> after tonight's train-wreck and the information I learned during
> >> it, I
> >> >>>>> believe that some LNC members from the other side are ready to
> >> change
> >> >>>>> course.  If I did not believe that to be the case, I would not
> offer
> >> >>>>> this
> >> >>>>> motion.  To preserve options for the LNC, given the 7-day voting
> >> period
> >> >>>>> for
> >> >>>>> an email ballot, I want to start this motion now so that it can
> >> >>>>> complete by
> >> >>>>> next Wednesday.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> I will have a LOT to say about this soon, as will others, but my
> >> first
> >> >>>>> focus is getting the co-sponsors.  Then we can debate.
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> -Alicia
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> <
> >> >>>>>
> >>
> http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail
> >> >
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> Virus-free.
> >> >>>>> www.avg.com
> >> >>>>> <
> >> >>>>>
> >>
> http://www.avg.com/email-signature?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail
> >> >
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >> >>>>>
> >>
> >> --
> >
> > *In Liberty,*
> >
> > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
> > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> > communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
> > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> faux
> > pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >
> >
>
>
> --

*In Liberty,*

* Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
(part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *