[Lnc-business] EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR CONCERNING REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
William Redpath
william.redpath at lp.org
Sun Jun 7 17:36:54 EDT 2020
I abstain. Bill Redpath
On 2020-06-07 12:19, john.phillips--- via Lnc-business wrote:
> I have been considering this vote.
>
> The multiple levels of possible issues here raise red flags in both directions, especially with the things brought up in other threads.
>
> Mr Coburn makes a good point in is his assertion that these votes should be taken about what is technically correct, however I believe he is incorrect on the clearness of the applicable rules, as several others have indicated different aspects that present a different picture. Mr Brown has given an opinion. Not just Mr Brown, but in my constant effort to base my votes on knowledge and logic I consulted some other parliamentarians as well. All of whom agreed they could argue both ways, that at best it was a grey area, so not clear cut. 2/3 indicated a very slight leaning against the ruling, but were clear to say it was very fine hair splitting and could go the other way.
>
> As such, one must weigh not just the technical aspects, but the "rightness". Indeed that is often the case on appealing a ruling.
>
> I have been considering changing my vote to abstain for these reasons, but as stated elsewhere am hoping to have some more response from other current members of the COC regarding the recent accusations before I make a decision. I have a feeling what it would be given their votes and conversations, but the entire board should know for certain, not guesswork based on assumption and implication as has become the current habit.
>
> I also believe we should hear from the staff members mentioned.. I am aware of both sides of some of that, but clear statements from them would be better. I am aware of the difficulty that might place them in so perhaps off list might be better for that, I personally believe in public and transparent, but understand the reasoning not to.
>
> Mr Hayes should also be given his time.
>
> I feel compelled to point out that we have done a disservice to the party in the handling of this. The reasoning originally given for Mr Hayes removal did give rise to the questions regarding its justification, and continue to give rise to questions like perhaps the chair was merely attempting to avoid a black eye to the party, or perhaps is now just seizing upon justifications. I would like to believe the prior, but appearances ....
>
> The continued behind the scenes maneuvering has only contributed to making things worse not better.
>
> If it was the prior then a different approach should have been used. If these complaints are valid enough to justify the removal at the very least an executive session should have been called to discuss the complaints and make everyone aware, and with the timeline I know of should have begun far earlier.
>
> Sadly given the broken threads I am unsure of when this vote ends and whether we have time to actually handle this properly. I hope that regardless of the outcome everyone will take lessons away from this for better handling in the future.
>
> John Phillips
> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> Cell 217-412-5973
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
>
> On Jun 7, 2020 7:42 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> He has. And he has been following this discussion and has not yet reversed
>> his analysis.
>>
>> * In Liberty,*
>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know. *
>>
>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 6:41 AM Elizabeth Van Horn <elizabeth.vanhorn at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> I'll remind this committee that Mr. Brown has been known to be wrong,
>>> and to correct himself when someone points out a different argument.
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> LNC Region 3 Representative (IN, MI, OH, KY)
>>> Chair-Libertarian Party of Madison Co, Indiana
>>> Vice-Chair Libertarian Pragmatist Caucus
>>> http://www.lpcaucus.org/
>>>
>>> On 2020-06-07 07:01, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>> Some emails got posted in the wrong thread. I am sure Mr. Coburn knows
>>>> where the belonged.
>>>>
>>>> On this I remind the rest of the LNC that our convention
>>>> parliamentarian
>>>> Mr. Brown has concurred with Ms. Mattson and I.
>>>>
>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If anyone
>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>> faux
>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>> *
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>> If you would like the direct quote from counsel I can provide it.
>>>>>
>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 4:42 AM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> He does not have the unilateral power of appointment. He cannot
>>>>>> appoint
>>>>>> someone not recommended. He does have that power with regards to the
>>>>>> chair.
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Sun, Jun 7, 2020 at 12:50 AM Tucker Coburn <tucker.coburn at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I vote yes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As the Secretary has pointed out, this vote is about whether the
>>>>>>> Chair's
>>>>>>> action was proper, not whether we agree or disagree with it.
>>>>>>> For that reason and the explanation below, I would urge members that
>>>>>>> have voted no to reconsider, particularly those that have paid close
>>>>>>> attention to RONR over the past couple months.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Page 177 of Robert's is very clear in stating
>>>>>>> the power to remove or replace members of the committee: If a single
>>>>>>> person, such as the president, has the power of appointment, he has
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> power to remove or replace a member so appointed; ...""Unless the
>>>>>>> bylaws or
>>>>>>> other governing rules provide otherwise, the appointing authority
>>>>>>> has
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I disagree with the Secretary and Ms. Mattson. Though the policy
>>>>>>> manual
>>>>>>> provides for a recommendation from the Members of the COC, it
>>>>>>> explicitly
>>>>>>> leaves the selection to the Chair. Further to the point, the
>>>>>>> Secretary's
>>>>>>> Report (Pg 64) from the 2018 December LNC Meeting Minutes states,
>>>>>>> "The
>>>>>>> LNC Chair appointed Daniel Hayes, Ken Moellman, and Drew Layda as
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> non-LNC members of this committee." There is no mention of the COC
>>>>>>> members appointing these three as they did not: they recommended
>>>>>>> them to
>>>>>>> the Chair for selection.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Chair has the sole power of appointment and thus also has the
>>>>>>> sole
>>>>>>> power to remove.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you,
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> Tucker Coburn
>>>>>>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>>>>>>> www.lp.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 13:58, Richard Longstreth via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>> I vote no and believe that the arguments have been thoroughly laid
>>> out.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> To Mr. Bishop-Henchman's point specifically, there is a distinct
>>>>>>>> difference
>>>>>>>> between the president appointing and the Senate then confirming
>>> versus
>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>> committee recommending and the chair then appointing. The spirit of
>>>>>>>> your
>>>>>>>> argument is certainly similar, but I see too much difference in the
>>>>>>>> circumstances to be convinced.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Richard Longstreth
>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>> richard.longstreth at lp.org
>>>>>>>> 931.538.9300
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Sent from my Mobile Device
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Sat, Jun 6, 2020, 07:36 Jeff Hewitt via Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I vote no. Jeff Hewitt Region 4 Rep
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On 2020-06-06 00:01, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>> > I vote no.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > -Alicia
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Sun, May 31, 2020 at 1:18 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >> EMAIL BALLOT 200531-1 APPEAL FROM THE RULING OF THE CHAIR
>>>>>>> CONCERNING
>>>>>>>>> >> REMOVAL OF DANIEL HAYES FROM THE COC
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> We have an electronic mail ballot.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are due to the LNC-Business list by June 7, 2020 at
>>> 11:59:59
>>>>>>> pm
>>>>>>>>> >> Pacific time.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Co-Sponsors: Goldstein, Harlos, Longstreth, Phillips, Smith
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Motion: The Chair has ruled he can not only remove Daniel Hayes
>>> as
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> chair but also from the committee entirely. Harlos appeals from
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling
>>>>>>>>> >> of the chair that he can remove Hayes from the committee without
>>>>>>> CoC
>>>>>>>>> >> approval since appointment required CoC approval.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> =============================================
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> THRESHOLD REQUIRED: A majority vote is required to overturn the
>>>>>>>>> >> ruling of
>>>>>>>>> >> the chair.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes
>>> here:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>> https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/d/1VntkXkkuQouUiWbt9bnI_TjSMKDiTaDDpvsYtTmJdhE/edit#gid=1053534570
>>>>>>>>> >> .
>>>>>>>>> >> Votes are noted with a link to the actual ballot cast for
>>>>>>>>> >> verification. You
>>>>>>>>> >> can find the time that the manual tally was last updated at the
>>>>>>> bottom
>>>>>>>>> >> of
>>>>>>>>> >> the sheet.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> Please notify me of any discrepancies.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> >> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>>>>> >> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>>>>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>>>>> >> anyone
>>>>>>>>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
>>>>>>> social
>>>>>>>>> >> faux
>>>>>>>>> >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me
>>>>>>> know.
>>>>>>>>> >> *
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>
>>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
>>>>>> Syndrome
>>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>>> anyone
>>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>>> faux
>>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>>> *
>>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>>
>>>>> * In Liberty,*
>>>>> * Personal Note: I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
>>>>> (part of the autism spectrum). This can affect inter-personal
>>>>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas. If
>>>>> anyone
>>>>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
>>>>> faux
>>>>> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and let me know.
>>>>> *
>>>>>
>>>
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