[Lnc-business] convention duration and costs

Tue Sep 2 22:46:15 EDT 2014

Mr McMahon and Mr McClendons points against Memorial Day are good ones. Pick a convention in a location that people want to attend...anywhere in Florida...Vegas..New Orleans...somewhere people like to go....and set it in June...do ya really think setting a convention on Memorial Day would have helped Columbus, Ohio attendance? There are other cities in Ohio that probably would have garnered more attendance...

Heck...get a convention in New Orleans and I can likely get you Walter Block as a speaker for a lot less than shipping someone in...he doesn't have to fly..doesn't need a hotel.. Let him release his inner AnCap and sell his books..and it could get even better... 

Starchild....I know your reading...you know you wanna do New Orleans..it's calling to ya...admit it..

Then...as far as convention duration goes...to save time....nobody try and make some brilliant motion to streamline things and save time...that wastes about 45 minutes a pop...but that said....we still might not have gotten to all the business done people wanted to....and OH the joys of approval voting.... having a shorter convention doesn't make sense...we are growing by leaps and bounds....in 15 years every state will be turning delegates away for their delegation.  Dr Liebermanns points about if we were at the size we should be...the 60k wouldn't so much matter...it's somewhat true..we are supposed to be good stewards of the money....but if we waste more time trying to save it,,,and "drive all over town to save 20 cents on a gallon of milk" what did we really save? Once again..it's about balance. We need to stop turning details of the convention over to people who earn a percentage of how much the convention costs to try and find us a so called deal and let the professional we have on staff handle it.

Daniel Hayes
LNC Region 7 Alternate Representative
Sent from my iPad

> On Sep 2, 2014, at 12:22 PM, Evan McMahon <indyliberty at gmail.com> wrote:
> 
> Brett,
> 
> Sufficient notice does not solve the problem of this being an important weekend for campaigning.
> 
> Holiday weekends cannot be scheduled away because you had ample notice. The parades and events will happen whether your campaign attends or not.
> 
> I prefer not to put active hard working affiliates in the position of having to choose between supporting their candidate or attending the national convention.
> 
> Let me rephrase that so my intent and resolve is perfectly clear... I will not put affiliates in that position. 
> 
> In Liberty,
> 
> Evan McMahon
> At-Large Representative
> Libertarian National Committee
> 
> evan.mcmahon at lp.org
> 
>> On Sep 2, 2014 1:12 PM, "Brett Bittner" <brett at brettbittner.com> wrote:
>> All,
>> 
>> We're all going to be able to make compelling cases for why a particular date or weekend won't work. We are a subset of the overall Party membership, so there are even more reasons that this weekend won't work or that one won't either that will not even make it on this list. The dates we choose will NEVER be ideal for EVERY member of this committee, let alone the membership as a whole. If we put the dates on the calendar far enough in advance, the people who want to attend will make it a priority to attend. Why do we fear calendar conflicts with sufficient and substantial notice?
>> 
>> Brett C. Bittner
>> 
>> brett at brettbittner.com
>> 
>> "I would rather be exposed to the inconveniences attending too much liberty than those attending too small a degree of it." -- Thomas Jefferson
>> 
>> 
>>> On Tue, Sep 2, 2014 at 12:22 PM, Guy McLendon <guy at mclendon.net> wrote:
>>> In 2010 I was concerned our current National Platform was going to be gutted by the persons who may still be interested in the "Restore 04" effort, and I was serving at the time as the Texas rep on the National Platform Committee.  IMHO, our current Platform is a masterpiece of human work, and merits great personal sacrifices to keep it intact.
>>> 
>>> My daughter's high school graduation was on the same weekend that LNC scheduled the national convention, so I was forced to choose between attending her graduation ceremony vs protecting the hard work expended by the 2008 convention.  My consolation was that, unlike our nation's founders, I wasn't duty-compelled to be away from home for years at the time.  Also further consolation, she was a national merit finalist, so I did get to watch her walk across a stage to get her National Merit award ... Still, every time I visit my Houston home, I see photos of my daughter's graduation ... where Daddy will forever be noticeably absent.
>>> 
>>> So ... I've got a strong preference for LP to not schedule our national conventions on weekends where high school graduations occur.  I'd avoid Memorial Day weekends because many graduations occur that weekend.
>>> 
>>> Guy McLendon
>>> LNC At Large Member
>>> Chair Affiliate Support Committee
>>> Libertarian Party National Committee
>>> www.lp.org
>>> Cell 832-372-8131
>>> 
>>> -----Original Message-----
>>> From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On Behalf Of Nicholas Sarwark
>>> Sent: Tuesday, September 02, 2014 10:48 AM
>>> To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] convention duration and costs
>>> 
>>> Evan,
>>> As a threshold matter, I agree with you on the importance of Libertarian candidates, campaigns, and supporting those candidates in their races for public office.  I believe that our candidates are way more important than the Libertarian National Committee or our national convention.  However, under the current bylaws, there still needs to be an LNC and that LNC still needs to hold national conventions every two years.
>>> 
>>> In fairness, every weekend prior to the election is an important campaign weekend.  Many of our Colorado Libertarian candidates did not attend the convention in Columbus, held at the end of June on a non-holiday weekend for exactly that reason.  That said, Memorial Day comes early enough in the election calendar that it's prior to the primary election in most states, so most of the media is not paying attention to Libertarian candidates, as their old party opponents aren't selected yet.
>>> 
>>> Unless we shift to conventions in odd years or conventions in late-Winter/early-Spring, the choice between attending the national convention and supporting candidates will always be present.
>>> Recognizing that such a choice will necessarily have to be made, it makes sense to me to optimize for (a) greater attendance and (b) minimal impact on candidates, in that order.
>>> 
>>> -Nick
>>> 
>>> 
>>> On Tue, Sep 2, 2014 at 9:27 AM, Evan McMahon <indyliberty at gmail.com> wrote:
>>> > Wes,
>>> >
>>> > Holding the convention over Memorial Day weekend is a major issue for me.
>>> >
>>> > It's not just about candidates campaigning. The volunteers, party
>>> > members, county and state party leaders should be out supporting their
>>> > candidates. In many states that is exactly what they have been doing.
>>> >
>>> > Making them choose between supporting their candidates on an important
>>> > campaign weekend or attending the national convention is just wrong
>>> > and flies in the face of our number one objective (as a political party)...
>>> > getting Libertarians elected to office.
>>> >
>>> > I will vote No one any convention that is scheduled during an
>>> > important campaign weekend.
>>> >
>>> > In Liberty,
>>> >
>>> > Evan McMahon
>>> > At-Large Representative
>>> > Libertarian National Committee
>>> >
>>> > evan.mcmahon at lp.org
>>> >
>>> > On Sep 2, 2014 11:15 AM, "Wes Benedict" <wes.benedict at lp.org> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Dan, I'll just list several areas where I see large savings potential
>>> >> without looking up all the details and writing up a formal report. I
>>> >> believe a formal request would have to come from the chair, the LNC,
>>> >> or a convention committee.
>>> >>
>>> >> 1. Choose a hotel that offers reasonably low pricing and terms. For
>>> >> example, in 2014 and 2012, staff recommended lower cost hotels than
>>> >> were chosen. There was a much lower cost hotel in Las Vegas (but
>>> >> still good quality). But still convenient to fly to for most of the U.S.
>>> >> 2. Memorial Day weekend conventions typically cost less than other
>>> >> weekends. If candidates are too busy campaigning, that's fine. I
>>> >> think the extra attendance at Memorial Weekend conventions is higher
>>> >> than the loss of candidates who prefer campaigning.
>>> >> 3. Shorten the convention a little (as Mr. Olsen suggested).
>>> >> 4. Those lunches and dinners cost like $40 to $80 per person at the
>>> >> hotels we've been choosing. Yet, we don't usually have a food and
>>> >> beverage minimum that requires us to buy as much as we do, and could
>>> >> choose hotels that minimize that.
>>> >> 5. A/V costs could be cut significantly.  $10k+. Use the screens in
>>> >> some of the breakout rooms that LPHQ has. Use a single screen at the
>>> >> front of the convention hall.
>>> >> 6. Those vertical state delegation signs used in Columbus cost about
>>> >> $2,500 but we already had a set we could have re-used. Now we have two sets.
>>> >> 7. Let staff make the convention website--which doesn't take long (we
>>> >> did that this year), but not in prior years.
>>> >> 8. Cut back on the speaker travel, meal and hotel expenses. You can
>>> >> get decent speakers for free or at lower cost. And you can have fewer
>>> >> meals and meal speakers. That way delegates can mingle more, or go to
>>> >> training sessions. You could probably sell speaking slots in some cases.
>>> >> 9. Keep staff travel expenses to a minimum. That was done very well
>>> >> this year.
>>> >> 10. Printed material costs could be cut in half by printing earlier
>>> >> at low cost printers instead of at the last minute at FedEx-Kinkos.
>>> >> 11. Staff tends to not like spending lots of money because we have to
>>> >> raise most of it. Non-staff convention organizers have typically been
>>> >> given authority to spend without oversight on many expenditures. With
>>> >> more oversight, suggested savings can be proposed.
>>> >> 12. "Right-size" the space. Which means be open to reserving a
>>> >> slightly smaller space. If attendance starts shooting through the
>>> >> roof, then let half the states sit in "class-room" style seating
>>> >> (with tables in front of each row of chairs), and the other half of the states sit in "theatre-style"
>>> >> seating in the back third of the room (no table in front of them--you
>>> >> keep your papers on your lap or under your chair).
>>> >>
>>> >> It all adds up fast. If all of the above were done to a significant
>>> >> degree, perhaps a $40,000 convention could be done. But I'd keep the
>>> >> budget at $60k to leave plenty of wiggle room.
>>> >>
>>> >> If staff were formally requested to provide a convention proposal,
>>> >> I'd start by brainstorming with Robert Kraus about where a few good
>>> >> cities might be with potential for low cost venues (still nice
>>> >> national chain hotels--but ones with lower than average prices), then
>>> >> I'd pick a few good hotels from those cities. That's not been our
>>> >> process recently. It's more been about selecting a state or city.
>>> >> Then picking a hotel. Cost has been further down on the list of priorities.
>>> >>
>>> >> Yes I'm too busy, but hopefully this email has the potential so help
>>> >> save at least $10,000 to $20,000 in future savings.
>>> >> I'm fully expecting the LNC to steal all of my ideas above and not
>>> >> stick staff with putting on the convention. : )
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> Wes Benedict, Executive Director
>>> >> Libertarian National Committee, Inc.
>>> >> New address: 1444 Duke St., Alexandria, VA 22314
>>> >> (202) 333-0008 ext. 232, wes.benedict at lp.org
>>> >> facebook.com/libertarians @LPNational Join the Libertarian Party at:
>>> >> http://lp.org/membership
>>> >>
>>> >> On 9/1/2014 9:16 PM, Daniel Hayes wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> Wes,
>>> >>
>>> >> I am a little lost here..Not sure where Mr Olsen’s referenced email is.
>>> >> If there are blatant unneeded expenses then please share those here
>>> >> with us Wes. Consider this a formal request from the District 7
>>> >> Regional Alternate for the information.
>>> >>
>>> >> Daniel Hayes
>>> >> On Aug 31, 2014, at 4:07 PM, Wes Benedict <wes.benedict at lp.org> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm confident a survey of members would show people would prefer
>>> >> shorter conventions. (I think that's what Mr. Olsen is suggesting
>>> >> below.) I don't recall that question being asked in a survey in
>>> >> recent years. But I do hear the complaint quite often that the
>>> >> conventions are too long, too boring, too much parliamentary
>>> >> theatrics, and too expensive. Shorter would be less boring and less
>>> >> expensive. Training could more easily be fit in before the convention
>>> >> for those that enjoy hanging around for more days. And for those that
>>> >> try to squeeze in local sight-seeing, a shorter convention would make
>>> >> it easier for delegates to join their families. One less average hotel night per convention would be a great goal.
>>> >>
>>> >> LP Texas had over 300 attendees at its 2014 convention at a cheap
>>> >> venue. I don't know the total budget, but I'd like be interested in
>>> >> knowing. And I'll take a guess it cost $25,000.
>>> >>
>>> >> The 2014 national convention in Ohio cost over $120,000.
>>> >>
>>> >> I'm pretty confident Robert Kraus and I could design a pretty good
>>> >> 2018 national convention for 400 to 700 delegates that cost $60,000.
>>> >> That's because he and I know of a lot of costs at the 2010, 2012, &
>>> >> 2014 conventions that could have been reduced or avoided.
>>> >>
>>> >> $60,000 versus $120,000. Our services and advice are available upon
>>> >> request (but preferably not this coming week due to other priorities).
>>> >>
>>> >> Wes Benedict, Executive Director
>>> >> Libertarian National Committee, Inc.
>>> >> New address: 1444 Duke St., Alexandria, VA 22314
>>> >> (202) 333-0008 ext. 232, wes.benedict at lp.org
>>> >> facebook.com/libertarians @LPNational Join the Libertarian Party at:
>>> >> http://lp.org/membership
>>> >>
>>> >> On 8/31/2014 1:21 PM, Norm Olsen wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> The schedule of official business of the 2018 national convention of
>>> >> the LNC shall consist of 2½ days, commencing on the morning of
>>> >> Saturday, May 26,
>>> >> 2018  and adjourning by 2PM on Monday, May 28, 2018.
>>> >>
>>> >>
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>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
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