[Lnc-business] MOTION Re: National Party Agreement and Joint Fundraising Agreement were signed by me today

Sam Goldstein goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
Tue Sep 20 10:17:06 EDT 2016 

If Weld and Johnson have not yet signed the contract, would the campaign be
open to a revision
of that clause to some extent?  It would solve a whole lot of current
problems.

Sam Goldstein
Libertarian National Committee
Member at Large
8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
Indianapolis IN 46260
317-850-0726 Phone
317-582-1773 Fax

On Tue, Sep 20, 2016 at 10:13 AM, Nicholas Sarwark <chair at lp.org> wrote:

> This reading:
> "Mr. Goldstein directed me to a particular provision that I believe
> requires the LNC to keep the terms of the contract confidential.
>
> I don't believe that precludes us from putting the same or similar
> provisions in a sample contract for future campaigns, but it may make
> it so that we are not able to disclose the exact terms of this
> contract even after the election."
>
> It does require and it does survive after the election.
>
> -Nick
>
>
> On Mon, Sep 19, 2016 at 10:01 PM, Daniel Hayes <danielehayes at icloud.com>
> wrote:
> > Which reading below?
> >
> > Daniel Hayes
> > LNC At Large Member
> >
> > Sent from my iPhone
> >
> >> On Sep 19, 2016, at 8:16 PM, Nicholas Sarwark <nsarwark at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>
> >> After discussing it with Mr. Hall, my reading below is correct.
> >>
> >> -Nick
> >>
> >>> On Sat, Sep 17, 2016 at 12:48 PM, Nicholas Sarwark <nsarwark at gmail.com>
> wrote:
> >>> Mr. Goldstein directed me to a particular provision that I believe
> requires
> >>> the LNC to keep the terms of the contract confidential.
> >>>
> >>> I don't believe that precludes us from putting the same or similar
> >>> provisions in a sample contract for future campaigns, but it may make
> it so
> >>> that we are not able to disclose the exact terms of this contract even
> after
> >>> the election.
> >>>
> >>> I've asked Mr. Hall to double-check that language.
> >>>
> >>> -Nick
> >>>
> >>> On Sep 17, 2016, at 12:39 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <
> carynannharlos at gmail.com>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> That goes beyond the authority granted in Orlando and should be a
> decision
> >>> of the entire LNC in executive session.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> In Liberty,
> >>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>> On Saturday, September 17, 2016, Nicholas J. Sarwark <chair at lp.org>
> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> The LNC keeping it confidential is not a provision of the contract.
> It is
> >>>> my choice based on the advice of our attorney.
> >>>>
> >>>> Please feel free to act accordingly.
> >>>>
> >>>> -Nick
> >>>>
> >>>> On Sep 17, 2016, at 8:40 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos <
> carynannharlos at gmail.com>
> >>>> wrote:
> >>>>
> >>>> Everyone and Mr. Chair:
> >>>>
> >>>> I think this question needs to be answered before anyone can
> meaningfully
> >>>> sign this NDA.
> >>>>
> >>>> Was secrecy until Inauguration Day part of the contract?  If so, I
> will
> >>>> sign. We gave the Chair authority to negotiate the contract, and
> binding the
> >>>> LNC to secrecy is arguably something he could do, though I am willing
> to
> >>>> hear arguments to the contrary.
> >>>>
> >>>> If secrecy was NOT part of this contract, I do not believe there is
> >>>> authority for the Chair to, without a vote of the LNC, force us to
> keep this
> >>>> secret.
> >>>>
> >>>> I need an answer to this question, even if the answer is "I'm not
> going to
> >>>> tell you" before I can make a meaningful decision on this NDA.
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> In Liberty,
> >>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> On Sat, Sep 17, 2016 at 7:44 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Starchild, I co-sponsor your motion.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> You articulated well misgivings I have in this whole thing.  I
> *never*
> >>>>> agreed at that Orlando meeting that this contract would be secret
> after
> >>>>> signing.  That was *not* part of the vote.  I feel completely
> hoodwinked by
> >>>>> this and feel it is completely unilateral and improper.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> Now perhaps this secrecy was part of the contract - *I have to pass
> it to
> >>>>> see what is in it apparently.* Ironic.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I am still deciding whether to sign and any modifications I will
> make to
> >>>>> this adhesion contract.  But it is under objection and protest.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I had no issue agreeing to keep confidential until signed.  I believe
> >>>>> that was part of our Orlando vote.  I do not believe this further
> condition
> >>>>> was part of our vote - and if it was part of the negotiations - well
> bad on
> >>>>> us for ceding that power.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> I will not make such a mistake again.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> As is my practice - I will confer with members of my region about
> this
> >>>>> matter and whether I should sign or stick to my guns. I likely will
> sign
> >>>>> because without signing I don't even know what my guns are.  How
> very old
> >>>>> party of us.
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>>>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>>>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>>
> >>>>> On Saturday, September 17, 2016, Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
> >>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Caryn, I share your concerns, and – Sam is correct – I have refused
> to
> >>>>>> sign any blanket non-disclosure agreement. The Bylaws setting forth
> our job
> >>>>>> descriptions do not contain any such requirement, and that being
> the case, I
> >>>>>> believe information relevant to doing our jobs must be made
> available to us
> >>>>>> without any further conditions except those which the LNC may vote
> to impose
> >>>>>> upon itself in accord with Article 7, Section 1:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> "The National Committee shall adopt rules of procedure for the
> conduct
> >>>>>> of its meetings and the carrying out of its duties and
> responsibilities."
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Nick wrote,
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> As members of the LNC, you are entitled to review the
> agreements
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> if
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> you will agree to keep them confidential.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> That statement doesn't say anything about being required to sign a
> >>>>>> blanket NDA covering our entire tenure on the LNC, and I hope Nick
> meant no
> >>>>>> more than what he said. I think we have every right as
> representatives to
> >>>>>> view documents that the LNC has voted to keep secret if we agree to
> keep
> >>>>>> them confidential on a case-by-case basis, rather than put our
> signatures to
> >>>>>> some all-encompassing legal gobbledy-gook that even a paralegal like
> >>>>>> yourself can't readily understand.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> In this case however, the LNC has not yet voted to keep the contract
> >>>>>> with the Johnson campaign secret. If it is deemed necessary to keep
> an
> >>>>>> official party document secret, I believe that decision should be
> made by
> >>>>>> the LNC as a whole. I don't think we want documents being
> essentially marked
> >>>>>> as "classified" by any one member of the committee, even the chair,
> without
> >>>>>> the consent of the body.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> What it comes down to is this:  Transparency and openness should
> always
> >>>>>> be the default. When secrecy is desired, it should require a vote.
> That is
> >>>>>> our practice when going into a secret meeting, and I believe it
> should be
> >>>>>> our practice in other cases as well. With this principle in mind, I
> make the
> >>>>>> following motion, for which I seek co-sponsors:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
> -------------------------------------------
> >>>>>> Moved, that the National Party Agreement and Joint Fundraising
> Agreement
> >>>>>> documents signed by the LNC chair with the Johnson campaign not be
> disclosed
> >>>>>> beyond members of the LNC and staff who have agreed to this
> confidentiality
> >>>>>> until January 21, 2017, at which time the documents will become
> public
> >>>>>> unless the LNC votes prior to that date to extend the term of
> secrecy for
> >>>>>> some additional period of time.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
> -------------------------------------------
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> To be clear, I am making this motion only because I believe this
> matter
> >>>>>> requires an LNC vote, not because I want this secrecy. While I am
> willing to
> >>>>>> listen to arguments for why the documents should be kept secret
> until after
> >>>>>> the campaign is over – the day after Inauguration Day is actually
> well past
> >>>>>> when presidential campaigns are generally over, but I used Nick's
> referenced
> >>>>>> date for the language of the motion – my own inclination is to vote
> against
> >>>>>> my motion and allow the information to be shared immediately.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> As with all that we do as a party, we have an opportunity here to
> model
> >>>>>> a better way of doing things and thereby set a positive example.
> I'd like to
> >>>>>> see the contract, assuming one exists, between the Democratic Party
> and
> >>>>>> Hillary Clinton, or the Republican Party and Donald Trump, wouldn't
> you?
> >>>>>> Were such contracts routinely made public, I believe the result
> would be
> >>>>>> politicians and party leaders being held more accountable. Why
> would we not
> >>>>>> want to be part of the solution by making it more routine?
> Libertarians
> >>>>>> seeking to advance freedom have every reason to welcome
> transparency and
> >>>>>> accountability, but the same cannot be said for their corrupt and
> >>>>>> power-hungry cartel-party rivals! A culture of transparency isn't
> just
> >>>>>> better in terms of being more compatible with a free society – it
> gives us
> >>>>>> as a party a competitive advantage over the establishment parties
> and their
> >>>>>> back-room deal-making which cannot stand the light of day.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Love & Liberty,
> >>>>>>                                   ((( starchild )))
> >>>>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> >>>>>>                                (415) 625-FREE
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Sep 16, 2016, at 9:18 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> Yes that one.  It does not say anywhere I could speak with you for
> >>>>>> instance... and will there be a record of who signed it?  The
> levels of
> >>>>>> security and destruction of documents are not specficied Can we
> discuss over
> >>>>>> FB messenger?  There is no ending date.  It was sent to me with
> purpose
> >>>>>> blank.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> I am not going to waste any further time arguing over it.  I will
> sign
> >>>>>> it because I owe it to represent my Region - if it was just me
> affected I
> >>>>>> would refuse.  I am noting my protest to this adhesion contract.
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> --
> >>>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> >>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming,
> Washington) -
> >>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>>
> >>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 10:12 PM, Sam Goldstein
> >>>>>> <goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> This one?  What specifically?
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Sam
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> Sam Goldstein
> >>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
> >>>>>>> Member at Large
> >>>>>>> 8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
> >>>>>>> Indianapolis IN 46260
> >>>>>>> 317-850-0726 Phone
> >>>>>>> 317-582-1773 Fax
> >>>>>>>
> >>>>>>> On Sat, Sep 17, 2016 at 12:05 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> Sam, I am a paralegal.  I don't take contracts lightly, and I
> have a
> >>>>>>>> huge problem with this NDA.  It is NOT a standard NDA as far as I
> can see.
> >>>>>>>> It doesn't say what you say.  I have signed a pretty basic NDA
> with LPCO.
> >>>>>>>> This goes beyond that.
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> >>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming,
> Washington) -
> >>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 10:01 PM, Sam Goldstein
> >>>>>>>> <goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Caryn,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> I'm fairly sure all members of the LNC during my terms on the
> >>>>>>>>> commitee have signed this agreement, excepting perhaps
> Starchild, and I
> >>>>>>>>> don't think I ever heard of any problems or repercussions.
> Pretty much just
> >>>>>>>>> don't discuss with anyone who has not signed it or relay any
> item identified
> >>>>>>>>> as Confidential so that a non-signed can access it.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> From my memory for the past 3 terms, the only items labeled as
> >>>>>>>>> Confidential have been legal matters, part of the budget related
> to employee
> >>>>>>>>> contracts, salaries and bonuses and sensitive parts of the
> annual audit.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Feel free to contact me to discuss in more detail if you like.
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Live Free,
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> Sam Goldstein
> >>>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
> >>>>>>>>> Member at Large
> >>>>>>>>> 8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
> >>>>>>>>> Indianapolis IN 46260
> >>>>>>>>> 317-850-0726 Phone
> >>>>>>>>> 317-582-1773 Fax
> >>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 11:41 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> I am a paralegal and am having issues understanding the
> obligations
> >>>>>>>>>> of this NDA, it is completely unreasonable.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> So can we discuss with other LNC members?  Only ones who have
> >>>>>>>>>> signed?  Will those who have signed be public knowledge?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Precisely how secure does my computer need to be?  Do I need to
> put
> >>>>>>>>>> a certain level of passwords?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> What level of destruction is required if I print it out and
> read?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> It was sent to me with "stated purpose" blank.  It has no ending
> >>>>>>>>>> date.
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> Seriously?
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>>>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> >>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming,
> Washington) -
> >>>>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 9:17 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>>>>> <carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> Well apparently we have to sign a multi-page NDA to even view
> it.
> >>>>>>>>>>> I have given my word, and I have never broke confidentiality.
> I would think
> >>>>>>>>>>> we have a right as LNC members to see it without having to
> consult with an
> >>>>>>>>>>> attorney.  Little did I know when I voted in Orlando.  Live
> and learn.
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> --
> >>>>>>>>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>>>>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> (Alaska,
> >>>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming,
> Washington) -
> >>>>>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 5:25 PM, Joshua Katz
> >>>>>>>>>>> <planning4liberty at gmail.com> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Mr. Chairman - thank you for your hard work and persistence on
> >>>>>>>>>>>> this endeavor.  I am glad it has finally been concluded, and,
> although I
> >>>>>>>>>>>> haven't yet sent my request, I have full confidence that you
> would not have
> >>>>>>>>>>>> executed an agreement that was not in our interests.
> Congratulations.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> I think that keeping it confidential until Inauguration Day
> is,
> >>>>>>>>>>>> among other things, a very reasonably optimistic action.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Joshua A. Katz
> >>>>>>>>>>>> Westbrook CT Planning Commission (L in R seat)
> >>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> On Fri, Sep 16, 2016 at 6:15 PM, Nicholas Sarwark <
> chair at lp.org>
> >>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Dear All,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> We have agreed on a contract with the Johnson Campaign and a
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> joint
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> fundraising agreement.  My copies have been signed and the
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Governors
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> will sign theirs shortly.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> On the advice of counsel, I will be keeping the agreements
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> confidential until at least after inauguration day.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> As members of the LNC, you are entitled to review the
> agreements
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> if
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> you will agree to keep them confidential.  If you would like
> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> do so,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> please email Robert Kraus with your request and he can send
> them
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> to
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> you.
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Yours in liberty,
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Nick
> >>>>>>>>>>>>>
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lnc-business mailing list
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> >>>>>>>>>>>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> >>>>>
> >>>>>
> >>>>> --
> >>>>> In Liberty,
> >>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>>>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>>>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> --
> >>>> In Liberty,
> >>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>>
> >>>> _______________________________________________
> >>>> Lnc-business mailing list
> >>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> >>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> --
> >>> In Liberty,
> >>> Caryn Ann Harlos
> >>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona,
> >>> Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) -
> Caryn.Ann.
> >>> Harlos at LP.org
> >>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
> >>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> _______________________________________________
> >>> Lnc-business mailing list
> >>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> >>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> >>
> >> _______________________________________________
> >> Lnc-business mailing list
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> >> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> >
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>
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