[Lnc-business] [Lnc-votes] LP.org website transition botched (as predicted)
Caryn Ann Harlos
carynannharlos at gmail.com
Thu Oct 27 11:13:47 EDT 2016
And now my picture has been removed. Why? I did not object to the "live"
shots, and I rather preferred that picture.
--
*In Liberty,*
*Caryn Ann Harlos*
Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska, Arizona,
Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org>
Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
<http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
<http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 7:49 AM, Sam Goldstein <goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com>
wrote:
> Here you go:
>
> https://www.lp.org/wp-content/uploads/2016/07/20160526_LNC_
> Policy_Manual.pdf
>
> Is is hiding on the LNC Minutes page.
>
>
>
> Sam Goldstein
> Libertarian National Committee
> Member at Large
> 8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
> Indianapolis IN 46260
> 317-850-0726 Phone
> 317-582-1773 Fax
>
> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 9:39 AM, Joshua Katz <planning4liberty at gmail.com>
> wrote:
>
>> To get to the Policy Manual, click on "Meeting Minutes" in the footer.
>> It appears on the top of the page, followed by the minutes arranged by year.
>>
>> I think the "type" of pictures used should either be an individual
>> decision (my preference) or be based on the recommendation of an expert in
>> PR/design/something. I am none of those things, and so I don't know what
>> the most effective sort of picture is. Unless we hear from an expert "all
>> pictures should look like X in the context of this site and what you're
>> trying to accomplish" I'm going to stick with board discussions about the
>> pictures, other than to say people can choose what they want their picture
>> to look like (within limits - I don't think my request to have mine look
>> like a lion should be respected...although...) is rather pointless.
>>
>> I look forward to a report at the December meeting where some of these
>> matters can be discussed more fully.
>>
>> Joshua A. Katz
>> Westbrook CT Planning Commission (L in R seat)
>>
>> On Thu, Oct 27, 2016 at 8:24 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
>> wrote:
>>
>>> Thanks for the laugh this morning at your photo descriptions Daniel,
>>> lol... :-D
>>>
>>> But seriously, that's kinda what I *like* about some of the pictures –
>>> they help people come across as the diverse individuals we are. I'm not
>>> saying none of the shots could be better, and if the LNC members you've
>>> mentioned want to select or provide different photos of themselves, of
>>> course they should be able to do so. But I'd be disappointed if folks chose
>>> to reject individuality in favor of "institutional" type photos that look
>>> like they could have been plucked from a corporate annual report.
>>>
>>> Good catch on noticing that the LNC Policy Manual is missing from the
>>> new site, if that is the case. I tried to do a search, but either it isn't
>>> loading for me right now, or when you search for results of a term that
>>> can't be found, it just displays a blank page rather than a notice saying
>>> it couldn't find the term.
>>>
>>> Love & Liberty,
>>> ((( starchild )))
>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>>> (415) 625-FREE
>>> @StarchildSF
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 27, 2016, at 5:00 AM, lnc-votes at hq.lp.org wrote:
>>>
>>> I have not looked very hard yet, but even at 5 am central in the morning
>>> the website is godawful slow to load. That's not a bitch, consider that
>>> informational purposes.
>>>
>>> On the LNC page. ( https://www.lp.org/libertarian-national-committee/ )Many
>>> of us paid for head shots. Moving away from that I think is a bad idea.
>>> Also, there are a lot of problems with this page from the standpoint of
>>> basic human psychology. Most of what I say below is Nov. 9th stuff, but I
>>> think correcting the pictures is a bit more pressing.
>>>
>>> Nick's looks real young and innocent. He reminds me of a kindergarten
>>> student in that picture. It's his picture but I suggest his pro head shot.
>>> I do think Valerie might like this one though but he convinced her to marry
>>> him so I think he is past the phase of convincing her he is credible and
>>> competent.
>>>
>>> Arvin's looks surprised like someone just told him he got selected to
>>> represent the school in the spelling bee and responded with. "REALLY?
>>> ME?!!!"
>>>
>>> Alicia's picture has her looking away and you can't see her eyes. She
>>> looks occupied. Its not as bad as the others but once again... Pro Head
>>> shot.
>>>
>>> Bill's picture is the one that caught my attention with this initially.
>>> Bill looks pissed off. He might have been pissed off. I feel ya Bill...I
>>> get pissed off a lot too like I will be in my next email after this one to
>>> the list. That said..NOT the picture to use. Pro head shot
>>>
>>> I think Larry's is a decent one but why not use a Pro head shot if he
>>> has one for consistency.
>>>
>>> That said... WHY? I now find myself involved in the task that this board
>>> shouldn't be involved in.. Micromanaging things. But at the same time, I am
>>> annoyed that staff time was spent deciding on putting these pictures here
>>> when all of the people I mentioned with "bad" pics in my opinion had
>>> professional head shots that they PAID for. Also where is Sam's? Never
>>> mind..I thought it was a broken link but it just failed to load the first
>>> time. Also, I think his picture is less than flattering compared to his
>>> head shot. I know there were others that had professional head shots. Now
>>> we have a bunch of blank spaces and many of our board members not looking
>>> very inspiring of confidence.
>>> e
>>> Additionally, the form of the page. Get the pictures of the people at
>>> the TOP instead of a Wall O Text mapping out all the regions. Put that
>>> below the pictures. IF someone needs to figure out their region or is
>>> interested they will look. Leave the link to the LNC reflector list at the
>>> top. Also, lose the spot where it lists the region of every member below
>>> the pictures because almost half the people listed don't have a region.
>>> Just list the region number in between the word Region and Representative
>>> where that is listed below each person's name.
>>> Let's include a place for people's phone numbers that want those
>>> included. Mine is 504-258-6176.
>>>
>>> Also where is the link to the Policy manual these days? I used to be
>>> able to find it by going to this page. It doesn't seem to be listed here
>>> anymore and doesn't seem to be in with the bylaws.
>>>
>>>
>>> Daniel Hayes
>>> LNC At Large Member Region:At Large
>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 26, 2016, at 05:05 PM, Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net> wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks, Kevin. Can you tell me which issues that I mentioned are *not*
>>> being addressed, and if/when you plan to address them?
>>>
>>> I'm also wondering about the specific issue I mentioned in my previous
>>> message about the LNC page losing information on the way over, because I
>>> got the impression from your comment "Staff has copied over existing pages
>>> and so nothing is lost or destroyed or anything of this sort", that this
>>> should not have occurred. Do you know how it happened in this case, and
>>> whether it may have happened in other cases as well?
>>>
>>> Love & Liberty,
>>> ((( starchild )))
>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>>> (415) 625-FREE
>>> @StarchildSF
>>>
>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>> On Oct 26, 2016, at 8:32 AM, Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>
>>> Thanks, Starchild.
>>>
>>> Your feedback is well-taken and to your point, most of the issues you
>>> mention are being addressed.
>>>
>>> -Kevin
>>>
>>> On Wed, Oct 26, 2016 at 4:04 AM, Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>> On Oct 25, 2016, at 9:05 PM, Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>
>>>> Thanks, Ken, for the constructive position.
>>>> As noted, I would really like to get actual problems with the site
>>>> organized so that they can be tackled. Staff has been working on testing;
>>>> I have been building the infrastructure.
>>>> It is very useful to be informed of visible problems so that we can
>>>> address them so any effort you're willing to make in that regard is highly
>>>> appreciated.
>>>>
>>>> ~k
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Hi Kevin,
>>>>
>>>> Not sure whether you saw my original post to the LNC list informing on
>>>> a number of actual problems with the site, but in case you missed it, here
>>>> it is. In light of your explanations in response to Chuck and Caryn, I'm
>>>> curious about one page which has been ported over to the new site but still
>>>> somehow lost some information along the way, namely the LNC page (
>>>> https://www.lp.org/libertarian-national-committee/) which no longer
>>>> lists any phone numbers or other contact info beyond email addresses. I
>>>> would like my phone number [(415) 625-FREE] and twitter handle
>>>> (@StarchildSF) added to that page. (Ideally I think every LNC member's
>>>> listing should include a phone number at which they can be contacted.)
>>>> Thanks, and please let me know if you have any questions about anything
>>>> else I wrote below.
>>>>
>>>> Love & Liberty,
>>>> ((( starchild )))
>>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>>>> (415) 625-FREE
>>>> @StarchildSF
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On 10/25/2016 12:53 PM, Starchild wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>> Yesterday, I'm told, the launch of the new and improved LP.org website
>>>>> took place. And on the whole, at a quick look, I'd say it *is* an
>>>>> improvement. Both appearance-wise and organizationally, I like the new
>>>>> site. I wouldn't call the difference earth-shattering, but my initial
>>>>> impression is generally positive.
>>>>>
>>>>> There are however a number of issues that have come to my attention
>>>>> which could use fixing, some more serious than others:
>>>>>
>>>>> • While the site looks good on the web, it looks terrible on my phone!
>>>>> The "Latest News" boxes show up as long, narrow, unreadable columns of type
>>>>> with a couple letters on each line. Considering how many people access
>>>>> websites on mobile devices, fixing this should be a high priority.
>>>>>
>>>>> • I don't see either the "Party of Principle" or "Minimum Government,
>>>>> Maximum Freedom" slogans shown anywhere (a search for key terms doesn't
>>>>> turn them up). Nor do I see the Nolan Chart except buried in a link. Each
>>>>> of these ought to be listed prominently, imho. The brief introduction
>>>>> statement when you click on "Libertarian Party" at the top of the main page
>>>>> is rather weak ("The Libertarian Party (LP) is your representative in
>>>>> American politics. We are the only political organization which respects
>>>>> you as a unique and responsible individual.")
>>>>>
>>>>> • The more detailed description of the party has a conservative
>>>>> leaning. Under "The Libertarian Option" (at http://libparty.zocalodesi
>>>>> gn.com/about/ , a URL that like that of many pages should also be
>>>>> fixed so that it doesn't include the web design company's website), it
>>>>> reads:
>>>>>
>>>>> Consider voting Libertarian or joining the Libertarian Party because…
>>>>>
>>>>> - We seek to substantially reduce the size and intrusiveness of
>>>>> government and cut and eliminate taxes at every opportunity.
>>>>> - We believe that peaceful, honest people should be able to offer
>>>>> their goods and services to willing consumers without inappropriate
>>>>> interference from government.
>>>>> - We believe that peaceful, honest people should decide for
>>>>> themselves how to live their lives, without fear of criminal or civil
>>>>> penalties.
>>>>> - We believe that government’s only responsibility, if any, should
>>>>> be protecting people from force and fraud.
>>>>>
>>>>> The first two points above appeal more to conservatives or people on
>>>>> the right (economic freedoms), while the second two points are more neutral
>>>>> in terms of left/right appeal. There is no balancing appeal to people on
>>>>> the left by explicitly mentioning things like a non-interventionist foreign
>>>>> policy or civil liberties such as ending Prohibition and reining in police
>>>>> abuse.
>>>>>
>>>>> • The URL for the candidate page has changed (hat tip to Thomas
>>>>> Knapp), and entering the former URL (http://www.lp.org/2016-libert
>>>>> arian-party-candidates) apparently now results in a page error rather
>>>>> than connecting people to the new page (https://www.lp.org/2016-candi
>>>>> dates/).
>>>>>
>>>>> • If the information about how to subscribe to the LNC email list as a
>>>>> non-LNC member got ported over, I cannot find it. I would suggest listing
>>>>> this both on the LNC leadership page, and on the LNC meeting archives page.
>>>>>
>>>>> • The LNC page only lists email addresses. Previously at least a
>>>>> couple LNC members' listings included phone number and/or other info such
>>>>> as Twitter address, but now those listings are gone and only email
>>>>> addresses are listed. I would personally like my phone number and Twitter
>>>>> handle listed, and encourage my colleagues to request their phone numbers
>>>>> likewise be listed, so that our members can readily reach us directly as
>>>>> well as in writing.
>>>>>
>>>>> • Where email addresses are listed on the website (for candidates, LNC
>>>>> members, staff, college chapter reps., etc.), they are spelled out. That's
>>>>> unfortunately asking to get us spammed by web-crawling bots that harvest
>>>>> email addresses. I recommend changing this so that addresses are listed in
>>>>> a less literal format such as Nick.Sarwark[at]LP.org
>>>>>
>>>>> • The page https://www.lp.org/_2016/ mentions Johnson and Weld being
>>>>> our presidential and VP candidates, but the photo next to the text is
>>>>> *not* a photo of Johnson and Weld, but of Johnson and a woman I'm
>>>>> guessing is his girlfriend (which is fine, but should be labeled as such so
>>>>> as not to give visitors the impression that the images reflect the text).
>>>>>
>>>>> • Our bylaws are referred to in the info at the bottom of each page as
>>>>> "LNC Bylaws" rather than "Libertarian Party Bylaws"
>>>>>
>>>>> • A number of people (staff, LNC members) are missing photos. To whom
>>>>> can we send photos of these individuals, if we have them, as well as our
>>>>> contact info updates for the LNC page?
>>>>>
>>>>> I realize the site has just been updated; hopefully some of the above
>>>>> issues are being addressed even as I type this message. And on the bright
>>>>> side, the new "candidate pledges" section listing candidates who've
>>>>> signed each pledge is a nice addition, along with the listing by name and
>>>>> state of life members, candidates, and elected officials, not to mention
>>>>> the attractive photos from the convention scattered throughout the site. I
>>>>> like that the membership and donation forms are single-page, and that the
>>>>> FAQ page addresses arguments against participating in the system at all.
>>>>> And I love the "Help Us Grow" page (http://libparty.zocalodesign.
>>>>> com/how-to-help/) and the addition of a "worldwide" link in addition
>>>>> to the state affiliates and campus organizations! But I would suggest that
>>>>> link directly to a list of the libertarian parties around the world, with
>>>>> that page then containing a link to and information about the International
>>>>> Alliance of Libertarian Parties. Right now it immediately leads offsite to
>>>>> the IALP page, which is a little confusing.
>>>>>
>>>>> That's my feedback at this time. If staff would acknowledge receipt of
>>>>> this message and keep us appraised of the progress in addressing the
>>>>> above-mentioned issues, that would be great.
>>>>>
>>>>> Love & Liberty,
>>>>> ((( starchild )))
>>>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>>>>> (415) 625-FREE
>>>>> @StarchildSF
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:59 PM, Ken Moellman <ken.moellman at lpky.org>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> I've been involved in lots of various projects throughout my IT
>>>>> career. This website project seems to fit the stereotypical IT project.
>>>>>
>>>>> I personally don't like the layout of the website, but I'm a grumpy
>>>>> "old" man who still likes 2006-era website layouts with drop-down menus and
>>>>> whatnot. The design we need, however, is one targeted at millenials. We
>>>>> know this because of the Johnson campaign's polling. That's the future of
>>>>> this party. I believe that this website accomplishes that task. I'd be
>>>>> interested to see how it looks on a mobile (I'm also still using a
>>>>> Blackberry. Don't ask.)
>>>>>
>>>>> Kevin - Thank you for continuing onward with this project, even though
>>>>> you are no longer on the LNC. As one who's been embroiled in volunteer
>>>>> projects that have run over time and over budget, I know how much of a PITA
>>>>> it is to put the time in and also take the inevitable hits. I'm sure you're
>>>>> all too aware, as well. But I wanted to make sure you knew that at least I
>>>>> knew and recognized what's up.
>>>>>
>>>>> Chuck, and others with concerns - Let's make a list of the "what's
>>>>> wrong", try to prioritize that list based on importance and easy
>>>>> of resolution, and try to work through them. Any website changeover will
>>>>> take time to fix. I know there are some "broken links" where people
>>>>> externally linked things like LP.org/join ... I have a cool graphic
>>>>> from The Advocates that we used on LPKY.org that has the same
>>>>> problem. These can ad should be resolved.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> As the new IT committee is formed, I'm sure we'll be tasked
>>>>> with assessing these issues and implementing fixes. I ask that everyone
>>>>> please be patient. We have 2 weeks until the election is over. If there's
>>>>> anything election-related that's not working, then we definitely need to
>>>>> address that immediately. Otherwise, let's get through Nov 8th and then we
>>>>> can push forward with this and other projects.
>>>>>
>>>>> ---
>>>>>
>>>>> Ken C. Moellman, Jr.
>>>>> LNC Region 3 Alternate Representative
>>>>> LPKY Judicial Committee
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On 2016-10-25 23:38, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> Thank you Kevin. I will cool my jets on that issue for a few days and
>>>>> check back in.
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016, Kevin Ludlow <ludlow at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> No problem, Caryn.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I wouldn't even think days. I would think A day. Staff was tasked
>>>>>> with taking each page from the old Drupal system and importing it into the
>>>>>> new one. As far as I know ALL pages were copied over. They were copied
>>>>>> into 1 of 6 (or so) different page templates that were created to serve
>>>>>> different formats of data. So I'm certain we have everything. Even if it
>>>>>> hadn't been copied over, we still have it and it would just need TO BE
>>>>>> copied over, but I don't believe this is the case. I believe in those
>>>>>> cases the links structure may have changed. We have been updating these so
>>>>>> that all incoming links to the old structure point to the appropriate new
>>>>>> structure and send out PERMANENT REDIRECT notifications to Google and such
>>>>>> (so things are updated).
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ~k
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:28 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <
>>>>>> carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you Kevin.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> That is why I was asking staff about them. If we are talking a
>>>>>>> matter of days for that content - that is reasonable. If moreso, not so
>>>>>>> much.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016, Kevin Ludlow <ludlow at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> Caryn,
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I genuinely am not trying to avoid those issues. I know content is
>>>>>>>> there. What I'm trying to convey is that from my point of view, if those
>>>>>>>> documents are "opaque" for another 12 hours, I'm okay with that. I realize
>>>>>>>> you might not be, but this goes back to my volunteering work. I have to
>>>>>>>> prioritize work that I am personally responsible for.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> So I will happily weigh in with staff and get links to them. I can
>>>>>>>> even check the admin pages and see what the current URL is provided they
>>>>>>>> have been copied and not linked.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> But I really need to know if anything is actually not functioning.
>>>>>>>> This is what my current workload is.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> I apologize if any of that sounds dismissive. It's not my intent,
>>>>>>>> but I can't do specific projects for you and/or Chuck or the LNC or
>>>>>>>> whomever else right now as I need to make sure the site is fully
>>>>>>>> functional. If/when it IS fully functional (which it very well may already
>>>>>>>> be), then we can address any missing pieces.
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> ~k
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:15 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <
>>>>>>>> carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Thank you Kevin for all your work.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> I can't though not desire answers on the minutes archives and LNC
>>>>>>>>> business list not being there. That is essential for members and cannot be
>>>>>>>>> optional.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> Can staff answer when those can be restored? This is an
>>>>>>>>> acceptable situation of opacity.
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016, Kevin Ludlow <ludlow at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Caryn,
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I've always gotten along with you just fine as you're very
>>>>>>>>>> reasonable.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> In this case, I respectfully disagree that it's useful to deliver
>>>>>>>>>> a 6-page rant citing the "I told you so" lines when the decision has been
>>>>>>>>>> done, executed, and is live. Further, I have been in this business for 20
>>>>>>>>>> years now. We had roughly 2.5 hours of outages this morning between
>>>>>>>>>> roughly 7:45AM and 9:15AM EST. This was only because of the unknown.
>>>>>>>>>> Staff has spent a lot of time testing this software. It was rolled over
>>>>>>>>>> twice already and rolled back just to ensure we COULD roll it back if there
>>>>>>>>>> was a major problem. The point being that we transitioned an entire
>>>>>>>>>> infrastructure from 6 services to ONE, the monthly cost savings should be
>>>>>>>>>> about $500 once everything is in place, and best I can tell nothing is
>>>>>>>>>> broken - there are just complaints that some things are missing (which
>>>>>>>>>> they're definitely not, but I'll concede that perhaps staff hasn't finished
>>>>>>>>>> adding links - I honestly don't know right now).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> There are no major problems that anyone has reported save for the
>>>>>>>>>> overloading this morning. The page content was always intended to / has
>>>>>>>>>> been / and IS preserved. If a link isn't immediately visible, then staff
>>>>>>>>>> can correct that if appropriate.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> IF there are broken links, namely as a URL may have changed and
>>>>>>>>>> needs to be forwarded now, I would really, genuinely like to know so I can
>>>>>>>>>> fix those problems. I offered that to Chuck. I offered it to you.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> That said, we can start however necessary. I have ostensibly
>>>>>>>>>> worked on this for 3.5 straight weeks. That is not because of the website
>>>>>>>>>> itself, but rather the years of garbaged up infrastructure. We would have
>>>>>>>>>> rolled the site out 6 weeks ago if not for all of that. My point being
>>>>>>>>>> that I've been voluntarily taking on FAR more work than was entailed in the
>>>>>>>>>> website redesign itself because our infrastructure couldn't handle the
>>>>>>>>>> modern codebase (it is roughly 8 years out of spec).
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I would ask that you leave whatever issues you have with content
>>>>>>>>>> alone for the time being. I'm not saying they won't be addressed, I'm
>>>>>>>>>> saying that it's not a primary concern. The primary concern is ensuring
>>>>>>>>>> that the site is running so it can serve up any content. IF there is a
>>>>>>>>>> problem with something not loading, we need to know that.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> Staff has copied over existing pages and so nothing is lost or
>>>>>>>>>> destroyed or anything of this sort.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> I need to convey though, that I am not on the clock for the
>>>>>>>>>> people on this thread. I have been, and am continuing to volunteer a
>>>>>>>>>> tremendous amount of time to ensure this is completed smoothly. I am happy
>>>>>>>>>> to try and fix things that are broken. I'm very uninterested in listening
>>>>>>>>>> to Mr. Molton rant on about his discontent with the structure. It's done.
>>>>>>>>>> That ship sailed in February.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> So that's where I'm at. By all means, please inform me of broken
>>>>>>>>>> pieces so we can look at and correct anything ASAP.
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> ~k
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 10:01 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <
>>>>>>>>>> carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> He was writing as a member to a busy elected to SERVE members.
>>>>>>>>>>> That means sometimes we will hear things we don't want to and have to
>>>>>>>>>>> respond to very upset complaints. No matter what anyone says -
>>>>>>>>>>> high-handed responses are not appropriate IMHO.
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> I didn't agree with Chuck's desire to see heads roll. I said so
>>>>>>>>>>> respectfully,
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> Can we start again?
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016, Kevin Ludlow <ludlow at gmail.com>
>>>>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Caryn,
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck opened with whoever made the decision was a MORON and
>>>>>>>>>>>> should be FIRED.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> I think my response was in line.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Regardless, I remain open to seeing links broken. I'm sure some
>>>>>>>>>>>> still exist. We launched the site this morning. Staff has spent weeks
>>>>>>>>>>>> testing the site and fixing links and such. I'm all for fixing dead links,
>>>>>>>>>>>> but 6 pages of complaints without any information is not helpful.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> Also, I'm not a member of the LNC. I'm a volunteer only. So I
>>>>>>>>>>>> don't really owe anyone anything. I've delightfully put in a couple hundred
>>>>>>>>>>>> hours so far. That's the best I'm willing to do at this point given such a
>>>>>>>>>>>> response.
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> K
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tuesday, October 25, 2016, Caryn Ann Harlos <
>>>>>>>>>>>> carynannharlos at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin, that was an inappropriate response to concerns of a
>>>>>>>>>>>>> member IMHO- his concerns are valid and shouldn't be dismissed as "oh you
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Libertarians, you are a minority - we can safely ignore you."
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where are the links to the LNC Business list, the old blog
>>>>>>>>>>>>> articles, and the past minutes?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Can we have the discussion without sarcasm and without putting
>>>>>>>>>>>>> down Libertarians as inconsequential?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 8:19 PM, Kevin Ludlow <
>>>>>>>>>>>>> ludlow at gmail.com> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Hey Chuck,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Thanks for the constructive feedback.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'll delightfully take credit/responsibility for whatever and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all actions you've written about. Please pardon Nick, Robert, Wes, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> anybody else in your crosshairs. I'm sure they'll be relieved to be spared.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm not going to read that entire document you've sent as
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've spent the last 3 weeks trying to fix the party's infrastructure for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the website TO go live. It was finished two days ago, it was launched last
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> night. That was my call.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What would be useful right now would be if you could point
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out the broken links so that we can assign permanent redirects to them.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Any page content that existed STILL exists. This has been made clear over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and over again. It's possible that some page links have not been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> forwarded, but I've been monitoring logs on all 4 servers all day and have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not seen many 404s. The downtime this morning wasn't actually from an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> outage, but rather ME under-predicting the load our servers would take.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This is admittedly because I didn't have any data to go on because -- well
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> -- we've not really ever kept any before. I made the best prediction I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could; I way under-estimated. The servers were scaled up and unless you're
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> seeing something different, the site has been running fine all day since
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> about 9:45am CST. It was running before that just fine too, but the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> morning surge in traffic overwhelmed it.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So anyway, if you'd like to submit broken links, we'd love to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> set up additional forwards. Overall though, I'm pretty happy with the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> change. I'm happy we've done it before the election - even if it wound up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> being delayed from our proposed launch of September 29th.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The old site was very, very bad. I know you're a tech guy
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> all the way. I know words resonate with you and not colors and images and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> feelings and emotions. But you comprise a very, very, VERY small portion
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of the American electorate and the new site was designed to appeal to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people who are visually oriented, not interested in reading walls of text,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and might have the attention span of a few seconds at best (eg: the vast
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> majority of people). It was designed for people who might not care about
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the Libertarian Party - in hopes that something grabs their attention and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> they begin to care. We don't need to "win over" existing Libertarians --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> or at least one would think, but it's honestly hard to tell these days.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Regardless, it was decided. It's done. You can hate it. But I'd still
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> love your help in knowing where links are broken instead of mostly ignoring
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> another wall of text. That would help ensure that it's in good shape.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you'd like to vent further, feel free to call me at
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 512-773-3968 to spare the group.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Sincerely,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Oct 25, 2016 at 8:56 PM, Chuck Moulton <
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> chuck at moulton.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> LNC members,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Many of the problems I warned about have in fact come to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pass. It is Cassandra's Curse: always right but never believed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> See the exchange from IPR quoted below (in the P.S.) for
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> context and institutional memory. I'll quote and discuss some of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> highlights here.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WARNING #1: TRANSITIONS CAN BE BOTCHED, LEADING TO DOWNTIME
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> — AT THE WORST TIME IN THE ELECTION CYCLE FOR SUCH DOWNTIME: THE
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PRESIDENTIAL CAMPAIGN.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> This buggy transition was implemented 13 days before the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> presidential election. That is the 13th worst day in a 4 year cycle to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unveil a new a new website. There were/are 1,448 better days to change to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a new website in a 4 year cycle.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Whatever MORON decided to switch to a new website today
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> instead of after the election should be immediately FIRED. Do not pass go,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> do not collect $200. FIRED. I can't imagine a stupider, more incompetent,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> strategically insane decision than pulling the plug on a working website
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and trying out a new, buggy website immediately before a presidential
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> election. It is INSANE.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like staff, but if Wes Benedict made this idiotic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> decision, FIRE HIM IMMEDIATELY.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I like much of the LNC, but if Nick Sarwark made this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> idiotic decision, SUSPEND HIM FOR CAUSE IMMEDIATELY (I'll gladly recuse
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> myself as a member of the Judicial Committee if he appeals).
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If Kevin Ludlow made this idiotic decision, RESCIND THE
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> FEBRUARY 2016 MOTION GIVING LUDLOW UNILATERAL AUTHORITY OVER THE LP'S MOST
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> IMPORTANT ASSET IMMEDIATELY.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Everything we were told about a professional transition that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does not suffer from the pitfalls I highlighted was a lie.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It takes significantly more time for lp.org pages to load
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> than before. The site has been down on & off all day long. For a while
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> people were directed to another domain whenever they went to a LP page:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> libparty.zocalodesign.com.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WARNING #2: A LOT OF CONTENT IS REMOVED. LACK OF THAT
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CONTENT MAKES IT MUCH HARDER TO ENERGIZE PROSPECTS; GET DONATIONS,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> VOLUNTEERS, AND CANDIDATES; AND TRAIN LIBERTARIANS ON BEST PRACTICES.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact (as predicted), a lot of content has been removed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> from lp.org.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> For example, as chair of the Judicial Committee I wonder
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> what happened to the webpage listing bylaws mandated committee members?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where is the link to the LP Business list?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Where are the LNC minute archives before 2015?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I could go on and on, but I cover this point more broadly in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> my next unheeded warning.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I was repeatedly assured that content would not be removed,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> except that the front page would be made less cluttered. That was a lie.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WARNING #3: BOTH CONTENT REMOVAL AND TRANSITIONS TO A NEW
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SYSTEM MAY LEAD SOME PAGES TO BE REMOVED OR MOVED, BREAKING LINKS TO PARTS
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> OF THE SITE FROM ALL AROUND THE INTERNET AND MAKING US LOOK UNPROFESSIONAL
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WITH 404 ERRORS.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The number of 404 errors is shocking! Activists have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> out there for months / years promoting our website by linking to it --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> especially during this presidential election. Most of those links are now
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> broken.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Just try clicking on many of these links:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.google.com/search?site=&source=hp&q=site%3Alp.or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> g&oq=site%3Alp.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've been told the solution is just to report each broken
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> link. That is ridiculous! It is completely unprofessional for a website
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition to be reactive instead of proactive -- especially given that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> broken links probably number in the thousands. We were assured that this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would be a professional transition, but that was a lie.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WARNING #4: A NEW SYSTEM REQUIRES RETRAINING STAFF ON
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> PROCESSES — TIME THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DEVOTED TO OTHER THINGS. EVEN AFTER
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> RETRAINING THERE WILL BE A LEARNING CURVE... EXTRA TIME FOR WEBSITE RELATED
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> TASKS THAT COULD HAVE BEEN DEVOTED TO OTHER THINGS.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> In fact (as predicted), staff has mentioned that the website
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition has taken staff time that could have been devoted to other
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> matters in this busy election season.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Wes Benedict wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://hq.lp.org/pipermail/lnc-business_hq.lp.org/2016/00657
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 7.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I hope we can get those things below implemented early in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 2017,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> however, and get back to LPedia and many other projects,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> but first
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> we're trying to roll out the new LP.org website.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> WARNING #5: INTERNAL SCRIPTS THAT CURRENTLY AUTOMATICALLY
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> SHOOT DATA TO STATE AFFILIATES SUCH AS THE VOLUNTEER FORM, THE WANT TO BE A
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> CANDIDATE FORM, THE INFO FORM, ETC. MAY STOP WORKING, WHICH WOULD DEPRIVE
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> STATES OF A VALUABLE SOURCE OF LEADS DURING A TRANSITION PERIOD.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Do these all still work? I don't know. I can't currently
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> test this as I am not a state chair right now. I hope someone is testing
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this stuff. Based on all of the other monumental errors highlighted above,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I certainly don't trust whoever oversaw the website transition to have done
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> this testing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> You all made a monumental error when you voted on this
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website. Please do whatever you can to minimize the damage and triage the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website that is being butchered before your very eyes. I hope the lost
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> content can be restored and the bugs can be fixed ASAP. Even if everything
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> is fixed within the next week though, the timing is still horrendous.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Life Member & Monthly Pledger, Libertarian Party
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> P.S. See below for context on this botched website
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition and eerily accurate prophesies from people with a clue.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://hq.lp.org/pipermail/lnc-business_hq.lp.org/2016/00416
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 4.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 1) Our website is a joke. I mean a real, horrible,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> laughable, "maybe
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it's 1996 and the www portion of the internet has just been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> unleashed" joke. It's got ridiculous internal ads all over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> it. It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> terribly organized. It uses bad images. It has an outdated
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> font, not
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> great font colors, and antiquated font-spacing and sizing.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It barely
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> functions on mobile devices. It's full of information it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> doesn't need
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to have. It conveys that we're not a serious organization.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://hq.lp.org/pipermail/lnc-business_hq.lp.org/2016/00428
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 3.html
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We want to do all of these things. So I'm asking you, just
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stop what
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you're doing for 30 seconds, reflect what could happen if we
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> actually tried to accomplish this one little task. What is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the WORST
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that could happen? We fail? We're in a very slightly worse
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> financial
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> position than we already are? But now consider what is the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> BEST that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> could happen? Maybe this tailspin of a cash hole we're in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> stops.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> MAYBE people would see that the LNC is doing something
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> external.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> MAYBE people would have their morale boosted just a little
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> bit and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be more inclined to donate. MAYBE we could use it as a way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> leverage requesting donations from people.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1321872
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> What's the worst that can happen? It's not $20,000 wasted.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> pretty stupid thinking there... accounting rather than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> economics. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> worst that can happen is the site is much worse than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> before. A lot
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of content is removed. Lack of that content makes it much
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> harder to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> energize prospects; get donations, volunteers, and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> candidates; and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> train libertarians on best practices. A new system requires
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> retraining staff on processes — time that coupd have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> devoted to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> other things. Even after retraining there will be a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> learning curve...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> extra time for website related tasks that could have been
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> devoted to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> other things. Will conversion of new visitors go up with a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> new
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> flashy styled website? Maybe, but it could also go down,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> which is a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> potential cost. This is especially likely when the focus is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> on
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> design/style rather than the technical features under the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> hood. When
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> content is removed it may piss off current donors and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> activists, who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> may reduce their donations and activism. Both content
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> removal and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transitions to a new system may lead some pages to be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> removed or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> moved, breaking links to parts of the site from all around
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Internet and making us look unprofessional with 404 errors.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> New
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> sites often start out with a few bugs and errors which can
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> take a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> while to track down... the site may look less professional
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> interim. Transitions can be botched, leading to downtime —
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> at the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> worst time in the election cycle for such downtime: the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> presidential
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> campaign. Internal scripts that currently automatically
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> shoot data to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> state affiliates such as the volunteer form, the want to be
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> candidate form, the info form, etc. may stop working, which
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> deprive states of a valuable source of leads during a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> period. That's just what I could come up with off the top
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> of my head...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> there are probably a lot more.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1321907
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've launched many large scale sites just in the past year
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and not a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> single one of those sites had any of the problems you're
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> referring
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to. They DID – when they were on our development and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> testing servers
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> – but not when they went into production. That's how web
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> launches
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> are done professionally. A thorough maintenance schedule
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would also
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> be implemented and the website would be designed for minimal
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> maintainability in the first place. ...also in accordance
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> with best
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> practices.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322226
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Furthermore, there is absolutely NO intention to remove
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Libertarian
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> content from the website. This crowd has an astounding
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ability to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> spin half-truths and bake them into something entirely
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> different. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> will clarify specifically what is meant by moving them
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> around.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> The FRONT PAGE of a website (for a non-profit, business, or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> any
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> other organization) is NOT to leave people with walls of
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> text. It is
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to create a fast and positive impression and to get a call
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> action.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Having dozens and dozens of options is incredibly poor
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> design,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> thoroughly proven to be ineffective, and generally an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> archaic
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website idea. The current website is not responsive; it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> does not work
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> well (and not at all in some cases) on mobile and tablet
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> devices.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322257
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Great! Somehow in all your emails to the LNC (I read every
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> LNC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> business list email) you never mentioned anything about the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition process. All you talk about is design/style.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If you can manage a transition process well, that's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> wonderful. It
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> certainly hasn't been done in the past. The transition from
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> FoxPro
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to Raiser's Edge was a disaster... it resulted in states
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not receiving
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> working dumps for a year and a lot of records being screwed
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> up
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (e.g., deceased coming back to life, etc.). During the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition a decade ago, the LNC meeting minutes archive
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> and the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Success 97 and Success 99 seminars were removed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> See the IT Committee discussion and report (pp. 15-16, pp.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 51-59):
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> https://www.lp.org/archives/lnc20061111.pdf
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> If there will be no transition hiccups, that's wonderful
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> news. You
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> still didn't address all the scripts on the website right
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> now and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the technical considerations Shane discussed.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm concerned about giving management of the transition job
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> who only
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> talks about design/style, wants to remove content
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> (supposedly...
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> though I see you have now clarified that), and never
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> mentions a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transition plan to minimize problems.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's great that you're finally talking about a transition
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> plan! It's
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not my fault it's the first I've heard of it though.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> There are lots of people in the LP (myself included) who
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> have seen
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> transitions mismanaged and are worried of a repeat of those
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> disasters. We're not saying the sky is going to fall
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because of you.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> We're saying the sky has fallen in the past, we have
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> documented
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> evidence of this, and you don't seem as on top of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> process as we
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> would hope to prevent similar problems. (You also seem to
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> lack the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> institutional memory to be aware of these past issues.)
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> That's a
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> matter of you not communicating your transition plan and
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> experience,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> not a matter of us being overly pessimistic.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322261
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I'm sorry you've had people half-ass these efforts in the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> past. I
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> definitely cannot say I'm surprised. I focus on style
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> because to the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> external world, style IS the most important thing. This in
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> no way
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> means I neglect the engine, but in 20 years of delivering
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> projects,
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> nearly 100% of clients will respond positively to a broken
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> system
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> that looks amazing over a badass functioning system that
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> looks ugly.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> It's just psychology. Again, it doesn't mean it doesn't all
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> get
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> done.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322267
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I've found libertarians have a different psychology than
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> much of the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> world. The tech saavy folks will feel talked down to or
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ignored if
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> you only talk about style, ignoring tech under the hood. The
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ideological folks will feel defensive if you malign
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> content. I fall
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> in both categories, as do others on this thread.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Just something to keep in mind for the future.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Stewart Flood wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322926
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> So they're creating a new website committee and giving it
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> authority
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to screw everything up without having to go back to the LNC
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> to get
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> approval on which one of their pals they give the money to?
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322930
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Yes, they created a new committee with unlimited power over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> website. Then they spent the whole time debating an
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> irrelevant
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> $10,000.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton wrote:
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2016/02/libertarian-na
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> tional-committee-meeting-streaming-now/#comment-1322938
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> I am hugely concerned about giving any one person carte
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> blanche over
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>> the website.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> ========================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>>> ========================================================
>>>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>>>>>>>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>>>>>>>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>>> ========================================================
>>>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>>>>>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>>>>>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> ========================================================
>>>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>>>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>>>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>> --
>>>>>> ========================================================
>>>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> *In Liberty,*
>>>>> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
>>>>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
>>>>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
>>>>> Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org>
>>>>> Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
>>>>> <http://www.lpcolorado.org/>
>>>>> Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
>>>>> <http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org/>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> --
>>>> ========================================================
>>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>>> 512-773-3968
>>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>>
>>>> _______________________________________________
>>>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> ========================================================
>>> Kevin Ludlow
>>> 512-773-3968
>>> http://www.kevinludlow.com
>>>
>>>
>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>>
>>>
>>> --
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>>> _______________________________________________
>>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>>
>>> --
>>> You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google
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>>> For more options, visit https://groups.google.com/d/optout.
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>>> Lnc-business mailing list
>>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>>
>>>
>>
>> _______________________________________________
>> Lnc-business mailing list
>> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>>
>>
>
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
>
>
--
*In Liberty,*
*Caryn Ann Harlos*
Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska, Arizona,
Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington) - Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org>
Communications Director, Libertarian Party of Colorado
<http://www.lpcolorado.org>
Colorado State Coordinator, Libertarian Party Radical Caucus
<http://www.lpradicalcaucus.org>
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