[Lnc-business] Accountability and frugality on LNC meeting expenses
Starchild
starchild at lp.org
Fri Jan 26 00:12:37 EST 2018
Caryn Ann,
I'm curious why you think flying up to three staffers to our meetings, and taking them away from their work at the office, is a good use of party funds when they could be reached by phone if needed.
I can understand having one come out, to coordinate shipping equipment for recording the meeting, some outreach materials, and others supplies, set up donor meetings, etc., but is more really necessary and being frugal with our members' funds?
Regarding free meeting spaces, I hear your concerns, but I still fail to understand why you see an issue with meeting at a member's home during the day for a formal public meeting, but see no issues with having an official fundraiser at a member's home at night where it's more of a party atmosphere and there is typically abundant alcohol present.*
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
RealReform at earthlink.net
(415) 625-FREE
*Not that alcohol is never present at LNC meetings, but its appearance tends to be sparse. Now that Ken Moellman has resigned, I'm thinking maybe I should take up his informal practice of bringing whiskey at the end of our meetings, lest we lose this valuable tradition. :-)
On Jan 25, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
> I have come to change my mind on staffers and agree with David.
> And also, I am not in favour of "free meeting spaces" (not the concept,
> but usually how it works out - I do not want to meet in someone's home
> - if there was some area meeting centre - those are rarely free - but
> that would be fine.... some small states have their conventions in Elks
> or Moose Lodges). And there are Libertarians who have more public
> spaces that they own that they may be willing to donate space for a
> meeting.
> I know a lot of people do not grok my absolute opposition to meeting in
> homes, but I have had members reading this list who thanked me as they
> have the same concerns.
>
> On Thu, Jan 25, 2018 at 9:27 PM, <[1]dprattdemarest at gmail.com> wrote:
>
> I will co-sponsor, but only if the motion is amended to three
> staff
> members approved in advance by the Chair or some other approval
> mechanism acceptable to the LNC body. The rest of the motion
> content is
> excellent. The Executive Director and the Operations Manager
> should
> always be there. The logical third staff member would often be
> the
> Development Director but could be other solo appearances, but
> only if
> justified by the agenda and approved in advance by the Chair.
> ~David Pratt Demarest
> Region 6 Representative
> From: Lnc-business [mailto:[2]lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On
> Behalf Of
> Caryn Ann Harlos
> Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 6:00 PM
> To: [3]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] P.S. – Re: MOTION: Re: August LNC
> meeting
> I will co-sponsor
> On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 4:33 PM Starchild
> <[1][4]sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
>
> wrote:
> In support of this motion, I'd just like to share a few quotes from
> the
> latest LP fundraising letter signed by our chair, which happened to
> arrive in my mail today:
> "We have a small team and we are very thoughtful about how we use
> our
> resources."
> "We always seek to produce high quality work on a thrifty budget."
> "When you give to the Libertarian Party, you can rest assured that
> we
> work hard to get the maximum effect from your investment." [boldface
> in
> original letter]
> I urge my colleagues on the LNC to join me in seeking to ensure that
> we
> live up to these claims when it comes to that part of the party
> budget
> which most directly relates to us as representatives, and not give
> anyone reason to accuse us of telling our donors one thing but doing
> something different in practice.
> Love & Liberty,
> ((( starchild )))
> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> (415) 625-FREE
> @StarchildSF
> On Mar 14, 2017, at 3:02 PM, Starchild wrote:
> I'm fairly agnostic on where we meet Joshua (though see below), but
> if
> it were to be Minneapolis, I'd be much more interested in hearing
> about
> what the Cyrstal Libertarians accomplished with their city council
> majority once they had it. We've all heard plenty about how to get
> elected (including, for those who called in, the informative
> teleconference you and Brett Bittner hosted just a few weeks ago on
> the
> topic), but we pay too little attention, in my opinion, to what
> Libertarians actually do once in office. Important to remember that
> winning office is a means to an end, not the end in itself. The goal
> is
> to advance freedom. The more we can show that to be happening when
> Libertarians hold office, the more reason voters have to elect us.
> As usual with our meetings, I'll look more favorably on locations
> that:
> • save the LP money by not paying for meeting room rentals and
> related
> expenses (e.g. catered food/beverages)
> • have locals willing to host traveling LNC members or others coming
> to
> the meeting in order to avoid/reduce lodging expenses
> • have party affiliates who want to host an LNC meeting in their
> area
> and haven't done so before or recently
> • have tie-ins with local (L)ibertarian activism or events
> Related to saving the party money on this meeting (and on future
> meetings by improving meeting cost transparency), I also make the
> following motion, and ask for co-sponsors:
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
> ------------------------------------------------
> Moved, that no more than one party staff member maximum be flown to
> the
> August meeting at party expense, that staff looking into meeting
> locations be directed to prioritize looking for locations that will
> not
> require any room rental fee or related fees/obligations (e.g. buying
> a
> certain amount of food, filling a block of hotel rooms, etc.), and
> that
> the LNC be informed within a reasonable length of time after each
> meeting of the total cost to the party of that meeting and the
> breakdown of expenses making up that cost, including amounts paid
> for
> flights, shipping, food, etc.
> ------------------------------------------------------------
> -----------
> ------------------------------------------------
> Love & Liberty,
> ((( starchild )))
> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> (415) 625-FREE
> @StarchildSF
> On Mar 14, 2017, at 7:27 AM, Joshua Katz wrote:
> I suggest Minneapolis, which is near Crystal, Minnesota, where
> Libertarians used to be a majority on the city council. This would
> enable us to have a session, maybe over lunch, where we can hear
> about
> how they won that majority.
> Joshua A. Katz
> On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 9:22 AM, Sam Goldstein
>
> <[2][5]goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> wrote:
> Dear LNC members,
> Many of us are in the midst of planning our summers and I think
> it is
> time
> that we take up the issue of where to have our meeting scheduled
> for
> August 19-20, 2017.
> I'm in favor of moving west for this one. Let's get the ball
> rolling
> with suggestions of locations and sites so we can narrow it down
> over
> the next couple weeks and perhaps have a decision done by our
> April
> meeting.
> Thanks and
> Live Free,
> Sam Goldstein
> Libertarian National Committee
> Member at Large
> 8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
> Indianapolis IN 46260
> [3]317-850-0726 Phone
> [4]317-582-1773 Fax
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> [5][6]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> [6][7]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> [7][8]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> [8][9]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> [9][10]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> [10][11]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.
> org
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> [11][12]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> [12][13]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.
> org
> References
> 1. mailto:[14]sfdreamer at earthlink.net
> 2. mailto:[15]goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
> 3. tel:[16](317) 850-0726
> 4. tel:[17](317) 582-1773
> 5. mailto:[18]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 6. [19]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 7. mailto:[20]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 8. [21]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 9. mailto:[22]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 10. [23]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 11. mailto:[24]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 12. [25]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> [26]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> [27]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
>
> References
>
> 1. mailto:dprattdemarest at gmail.com
> 2. mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org
> 3. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 4. mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
> 5. mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
> 6. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 7. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 8. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 9. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 10. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 11. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 12. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 13. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 14. mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
> 15. mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
> 16. tel:(317) 850-0726
> 17. tel:(317) 582-1773
> 18. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 19. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 20. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 21. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 22. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 23. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 24. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 25. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
> 26. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> 27. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
> _______________________________________________
> Lnc-business mailing list
> Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
> http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
-------------- next part --------------
Caryn Ann,
I'm curious why you think flying up to three staffers to our meetings,
and taking them away from their work at the office, is a good use of
party funds when they could be reached by phone if needed.
I can understand having one come out, to coordinate shipping equipment
for recording the meeting, some outreach materials, and others
supplies, set up donor meetings, etc., but is more really necessary and
being frugal with our members' funds?
Regarding free meeting spaces, I hear your concerns, but I still fail
to understand why you see an issue with meeting at a member's home
during the day for a formal public meeting, but see no issues with
having an official fundraiser at a member's home at night where it's
more of a party atmosphere and there is typically abundant alcohol
present.*
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
[1]RealReform at earthlink.net
(415) 625-FREE
*Not that alcohol is never present at LNC meetings, but its appearance
tends to be sparse. Now that Ken Moellman has resigned, I'm thinking
maybe I should take up his informal practice of bringing whiskey at the
end of our meetings, lest we lose this valuable tradition. :-)
On Jan 25, 2018, at 8:48 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
I have come to change my mind on staffers and agree with David.
And also, I am not in favour of "free meeting spaces" (not the
concept,
but usually how it works out - I do not want to meet in someone's
home
- if there was some area meeting centre - those are rarely free - but
that would be fine.... some small states have their conventions in
Elks
or Moose Lodges). And there are Libertarians who have more public
spaces that they own that they may be willing to donate space for a
meeting.
I know a lot of people do not grok my absolute opposition to meeting
in
homes, but I have had members reading this list who thanked me as
they
have the same concerns.
On Thu, Jan 25, 2018 at 9:27 PM, <[1]dprattdemarest at gmail.com> wrote:
I will co-sponsor, but only if the motion is amended to three
staff
members approved in advance by the Chair or some other approval
mechanism acceptable to the LNC body. The rest of the motion
content is
excellent. The Executive Director and the Operations Manager
should
always be there. The logical third staff member would often be
the
Development Director but could be other solo appearances, but
only if
justified by the agenda and approved in advance by the Chair.
~David Pratt Demarest
Region 6 Representative
From: Lnc-business [mailto:[2]lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On
Behalf Of
Caryn Ann Harlos
Sent: Tuesday, March 14, 2017 6:00 PM
To: [3]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] P.S. � Re: MOTION: Re: August LNC
meeting
I will co-sponsor
On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 4:33 PM Starchild
<[1][4]sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
wrote:
In support of this motion, I'd just like to share a few quotes
from
the
latest LP fundraising letter signed by our chair, which happened
to
arrive in my mail today:
"We have a small team and we are very thoughtful about how we use
our
resources."
"We always seek to produce high quality work on a thrifty budget."
"When you give to the Libertarian Party, you can rest assured that
we
work hard to get the maximum effect from your investment."
[boldface
in
original letter]
I urge my colleagues on the LNC to join me in seeking to ensure
that
we
live up to these claims when it comes to that part of the party
budget
which most directly relates to us as representatives, and not give
anyone reason to accuse us of telling our donors one thing but
doing
something different in practice.
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
(415) 625-FREE
@StarchildSF
On Mar 14, 2017, at 3:02 PM, Starchild wrote:
I'm fairly agnostic on where we meet Joshua (though see below),
but
if
it were to be Minneapolis, I'd be much more interested in hearing
about
what the Cyrstal Libertarians accomplished with their city council
majority once they had it. We've all heard plenty about how to get
elected (including, for those who called in, the informative
teleconference you and Brett Bittner hosted just a few weeks ago
on
the
topic), but we pay too little attention, in my opinion, to what
Libertarians actually do once in office. Important to remember
that
winning office is a means to an end, not the end in itself. The
goal
is
to advance freedom. The more we can show that to be happening when
Libertarians hold office, the more reason voters have to elect us.
As usual with our meetings, I'll look more favorably on locations
that:
� save the LP money by not paying for meeting room rentals and
related
expenses (e.g. catered food/beverages)
� have locals willing to host traveling LNC members or others
coming
to
the meeting in order to avoid/reduce lodging expenses
� have party affiliates who want to host an LNC meeting in their
area
and haven't done so before or recently
� have tie-ins with local (L)ibertarian activism or events
Related to saving the party money on this meeting (and on future
meetings by improving meeting cost transparency), I also make the
following motion, and ask for co-sponsors:
------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
------------------------------------------------
Moved, that no more than one party staff member maximum be flown
to
the
August meeting at party expense, that staff looking into meeting
locations be directed to prioritize looking for locations that
will
not
require any room rental fee or related fees/obligations (e.g.
buying
a
certain amount of food, filling a block of hotel rooms, etc.), and
that
the LNC be informed within a reasonable length of time after each
meeting of the total cost to the party of that meeting and the
breakdown of expenses making up that cost, including amounts paid
for
flights, shipping, food, etc.
------------------------------------------------------------
-----------
------------------------------------------------
Love & Liberty,
((( starchild )))
At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
(415) 625-FREE
@StarchildSF
On Mar 14, 2017, at 7:27 AM, Joshua Katz wrote:
I suggest Minneapolis, which is near Crystal, Minnesota, where
Libertarians used to be a majority on the city council. This
would
enable us to have a session, maybe over lunch, where we can hear
about
how they won that majority.
Joshua A. Katz
On Tue, Mar 14, 2017 at 9:22 AM, Sam Goldstein
<[2][5]goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> wrote:
Dear LNC members,
Many of us are in the midst of planning our summers and I think
it is
time
that we take up the issue of where to have our meeting scheduled
for
August 19-20, 2017.
I'm in favor of moving west for this one. Let's get the ball
rolling
with suggestions of locations and sites so we can narrow it down
over
the next couple weeks and perhaps have a decision done by our
April
meeting.
Thanks and
Live Free,
Sam Goldstein
Libertarian National Committee
Member at Large
8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101
Indianapolis IN 46260
[3]317-850-0726 Phone
[4]317-582-1773 Fax
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[5][6]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
[6][7]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[7][8]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
[8][9]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[9][10]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
[10][11]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.
org
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[11][12]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
[12][13]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.
org
References
1. mailto:[14]sfdreamer at earthlink.net
2. mailto:[15]goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
3. tel:[16](317) 850-0726
4. tel:[17](317) 582-1773
5. mailto:[18]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
6. [19]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
7. mailto:[20]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
8. [21]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
9. mailto:[22]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
10. [23]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
11. mailto:[24]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
12. [25]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[26]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
[27]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
References
1. [2]mailto:dprattdemarest at gmail.com
2. [3]mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org
3. [4]mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
4. [5]mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
5. [6]mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
6. [7]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
7. [8]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
8. [9]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
9. [10]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
10. [11]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
11. [12]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
12. [13]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
13. [14]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
14. [15]mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
15. [16]mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
16. tel:(317) 850-0726
17. tel:(317) 582-1773
18. [17]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
19. [18]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
20. [19]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
21. [20]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
22. [21]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
23. [22]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
24. [23]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
25. [24]http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
26. [25]mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
27. [26]http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
[27]Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
References
1. mailto:RealReform at earthlink.net
2. mailto:dprattdemarest at gmail.com
3. mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org
4. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
5. mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
6. mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
7. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
8. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
9. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
10. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
11. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
12. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
13. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
14. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
15. mailto:sfdreamer at earthlink.net
16. mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com
17. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
18. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
19. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
20. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
21. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
22. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
23. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
24. http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org
25. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
26. http://hq.lp.org/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business
27. mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org
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