[Lnc-business] Concerned member
Alex Merced (Region 8 Alt)
alex.merced at lp.org
Sat Apr 7 15:49:15 EDT 2018
1. I agree with Caryn we should be careful to attribute any individuals expressions to an entire group. I’m sure I can find someone in any organization that we have some deep maybe even irreconcilable differences with.
2. If these kind of expressions become pervasive and disruptive then it’s incumbent on those associated with the person to decide what they want to be associated with. If enough people in an organization tolerate those who undermine its goals then they are left with the consequences when people walk away.
3. In that, I agree with Starchild, if it turns out this is the kind of thing the AC does tolerate then disassociation seems like an attractive option. (Which would be up to AC members and and LPMI members regarding the person in question)
AM
Sent from my iPhone
> On Apr 7, 2018, at 2:38 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
>
> Dr. Lark I will get in touch with you as well. Not all the
> intimidation is physical (but when there are comments like those shared
> by the concerned member the unspoken subtext is there) - I was
> physically intimidated at convention and violence almost broke out when
> members of the CO delegation thought the guy was going to need to be
> taken down.
>
> I don’t mind sharing publicly any details of my experience (I’m also
> the subject of a sustained sexual harassment campaign - not by any
> official - just another Party member who apparently has been harassing
> people for decades). The other ladies I don’t have consent to share
> publicly.
>
> I’m pretty tough- bullies make me more firm in my resolve but I imagine
> we are silently losing members who are frightened.
>
> There are different concerns and perspectives of men and women. I
> don’t think as a Party we do anywhere near enough to recognize that for
> many, women’s perception of safety can be very different from men.
>
> These screenshots go far beyond this particular member to a wider
> cultural issue.
>
> And it’s not that we can directly “do” anything - freedom means the
> freedom to be awful people - but we can make us inhospitable to such.
> We couldn’t “do” anything to the far right entryists but we did draw a
> line in the sand.
>
> Though something should have been done about the convention incident.
> It was legal assault.
>
> On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 12:34 PM Caryn Ann Harlos
> <[1]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
>
> Sure I thing Bill- I’m at the Louisiana Convention this weekend but
> will when I can.
>
> On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 11:39 AM William Redpath
> <[2]william.redpath at lp.org> wrote:
>
> Caryn Ann: I am unaware of what you are asserting below. I would
> like
> to know more. When you can, and if you like, please call me at
> 703-864-2132. Please leave a voicemail if I don't pick up. Thanks,
> Bill Redpath
>> On 2018-04-07 11:58, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>> I would caution against making this about any particular caucus.
> What
>> it is about is tolerating or giving succor to anyone who would
> be
>> openly advocating these things within the Party. The people
> change.
>> Caucuses change. This has been something that was a "do not
> cross"
>> line since day one of the Party.
>> I will say what I have been saying. We invited
> ethno-nationalists
>> to
>> GTFO (which was a proud moment for our Party) yet we are
> absolutely
>> SILENT to the very real issues of far leftist and violent
>> revolutionary
>> entryism.
>> Why?
>> And we are ignoring other things. Yes, yes affiliates are
>> autonomous
>> and we cannot tell them what to do, but we CAN use our bully
> pulpit
>> to
>> make it clear that this is not what the LP is about. We have
> an
>> intimidation problem in this Party and nothing is done. I have
>> mentioned over and over the physical intimidation (legally
> assault)
>> that happened to me last convention to pretty much utter
> silence.
>> Why? There are cases of woman leaders being intimidated out of
> the
>> Party (details can be given in private).
>> This needs to stop.
>>
>> On Sat, Apr 7, 2018 at 9:10 AM, <[1][3]erin.adams at lp.org>
> wrote:
>>
>> I am going to mirror Starchild in saying "If the Audacious
> Caucus
>> is
>> okay with this, I don't want to be associated with them. I
> don't
>> want anybody using me as a human shield. "
>> Ditto
>>
>> On 2018-04-07 03:14, Starchild wrote:
>>
>> Well put, both of you (Steven and Sam).
>> Jason, I appreciate and share your concern. If James
> Wood
>> wrote that
>> stuff, I don't know what he thinks he's doing, but I don't
>> appreciate
>> it.
>> The idea that Tim McVeigh was right to attack the
> federal
>> government, but that he should have done proper
> reconnaissance so
>> as
>> to have been aware of the kids in the daycare center
> cynically
>> believed to have been used by the Feds as deliberate human
> shields
>> is
>> not one I'm going to argue with on moral grounds.
>> However I will point out that given how governments
> have
>> often
>> treated those they label as "terrorists" or their associates,
>> anyone
>> who expresses an affinity, especially an organizational
> affinity,
>> with
>> terrorists; openly calls for responding to government
> violence
>> with
>> civilian violence; or even engages in actual violence such as
>> Peter
>> Hendrickson did – the NY Times magazine article you link
>>
> ([2][4]https://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/03/29/magazine/29taxes-t.html
> )
>> is
>> quite an interesting read – while actively associating
> themselves
>> with
>> the institutionally non-violent Libertarian Party and its
>> followers,
>> is in effect using US as their human shields.
>> A simpler and clearer example of this would be
> attending a
>> peaceful
>> anti-police-abuse demonstration, and while marching, running
> up to
>> nearby police lines yelling at and threatening to punch a
> cop, and
>> then running back into the midst of the peaceful
> demonstrators and
>> rejoining the march. It exposes people and organizations to
>> collateral
>> damage they did not sign up for, including risk of direct
> physical
>> harm.
>> If the Audacious Caucus is okay with this, I don't
> want to
>> be
>> associated with them. I don't want anybody using me as a
> human
>> shield.
>> Deciding to take up arms against tyranny or actively
> work
>> with those
>> who do, and assume all the risks attendant to that choice, is
> a
>> very
>> personal decision for each individual to make. If and when I
> ever
>> make
>> that choice, I want it to be my choice alone – and if I make
> it,
>> it
>> will be to join FREEDOM FIGHTERS, not terrorists, "domestic"
> or
>> otherwise.
>> Love & Liberty,
>> ((( starchild )))
>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>> [3][5]RealReform at earthlink.net
>> (415) 625-FREE
>> @StarchildSF
>> On Apr 6, 2018, at 10:55 AM, Sam Goldstein wrote:
>>
>> Jason,
>> I will also add to Mr. Nekhalia's comments below that Mr.
> Wood is
>> not a current member of the national Libertarian Party. You
> might
>> contact the MILP to discuss your concerns with them since
> they do
>> have a history of taking action against rogue members.
>> In Liberty,
>> ---
>> Sam Goldstein
>> Libertarian National Committee
>> 317-850-0726 Cell
>> On 2018-04-06 13:03, [4][6]steven.nekhaila at lp.org wrote:
>>
>> Hello Jason,
>> Thank you for bringing this to our attention, this is not
>> something
>> the Libertarian National Committee can specifically address
> other
>> than
>> coaching the Libertarian Party of Michigan if they seek to
> take
>> action
>> against this member. If this individual decides to make
> credible
>> threats, I would trust those who observe such threats to make
> the
>> proper the call on action, whether its reporting it to the
>> Michigan
>> Libertarian Party or appropriate bodies as they see fit,
> there is
>> nothing we can do as National. I do not wish to be dismissive
> of
>> your
>> concerns, but being associated with the Libertarian Party is
> to be
>> associated with hundreds of thousands of others who call
>> themselves
>> libertarians and Libertarian Party members. Republicans,
>> Democrats,
>> and Libertarians are all capable of being "audacious" and
> saying
>> something outrageous, even acting out, one person is not,
> however,
>> representative of the whole. Your association with the party
> is
>> the
>> water that dilutes the pollution, I do not see the pollution
> as
>> the
>> reason to leave. You will find there is pollution everywhere
> you
>> go.
>> As for a shadow rising of the LNC, I am not overly concerned,
>> while
>> these small groups may be loud, they have no power unless
> they are
>> elected by the delegates.
>> In Liberty,
>> Steven Nekhaila
>> Region 2 Representative Alternate
>> On 2018-04-06 11:35 AM, Someone Else wrote:
>>
>> Greetings,
>> I became a foundation member of the National Party on
> 6/19/2017
>> and
>> I
>> registered with my State party shortly before the 2016
> election. I
>> am
>> currently a precinct committeeman.
>> As someone who is considering whether or not to step up my
>> involvement
>> or to go back to being a non-voting Independent, I would
> like to
>> express a concern that I have regarding something I recently
>> observed.
>> I hope this isn't simply dismissed as "Facebook Drama" or
> just the
>> Audacious Caucus doing their thing, because it goes beyond
> that.
>> I have attached a series of screenshots of comments made by
> Jeff
>> Wood
>> of the Audacious Caucus and the Libertarian Party of Michigan
> in
>> which
>> he cites the 1990 Scarborough Tax Day Mail Bombing as a
> source of
>> inspiration as well as defending the actions of Timothy
> McVeigh
>> and
>> offers a "blanket invitation to domestic terrorists and
> violent
>> drug
>> cartels" to join the Libertarian Party. He also boldly
> states "I
>> fully intend to shoot police and soldiers with automatic
> weapons
>> at
>> some point in my lifetime".
>> I shouldn't have to explain why this is a concern. I realize
> the
>> whole Audacious thing is about being "so outrageous they
> can't be
>> ignored", but he is openly advocating for domestic terrorists
> to
>> join
>> the party. Between this and certain other members of the
> danger
>> caucus who claim to be actively recruiting Antifa, I am
>> considering
>> withdrawing any future support for this Party as I cannot in
> good
>> conscience be associated with such things. My wife is already
>> reluctant to join and needless to say this has not helped me
>> convince
>> her.
>> I am not going to presume to suggest what, if anything, the
> LNC
>> should
>> do about this matter, but I feel it is necessary to bring it
> to
>> your
>> attention. I will say that if the so-called "Shadow LNC
> Rising"
>> aka
>> Audacious Caucus and their affiliated groups ever gain a
>> significant
>> foothold in the LP beyond their little echo chamber (which
>> certainly
>> appears to be their goal) I will leave and never look back.
>> Thank you for your time. Please view and consider the
>> attachments.
>> In Liberty,
>> Jason Gillam, MCLP PCM
>>
>> --
>> --
>> In Liberty,
>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee
> (Alaska,
>> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming,
>> Washington)
>> - [5]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
>> Communications Director, [6]Libertarian Party of Colorado
>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee
>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> We defend your rights
>> And oppose the use of force
>> Taxation is theft
>>
>> References
>>
>> 1. mailto:[7]erin.adams at lp.org
>> 2.
> [8]https://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/03/29/magazine/29taxes-t.html
>> 3. mailto:[9]RealReform at earthlink.net
>> 4. mailto:[10]steven.nekhaila at lp.org
>> 5. mailto:[11]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>> 6. [12]http://www.lpcolorado.org/
>
> --
>
> --
>
> In Liberty,
> Caryn Ann Harlos
>
> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)
> - [13]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> Communications Director, [14]Libertarian Party of Colorado
>
> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee
> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
> We defend your rights
> And oppose the use of force
> Taxation is theft
>
> --
>
> --
> In Liberty,
> Caryn Ann Harlos
> Region 1 Representative, Libertarian National Committee (Alaska,
> Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)
> - [15]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org
> Communications Director, [16]Libertarian Party of Colorado
> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee
> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
> We defend your rights
> And oppose the use of force
> Taxation is theft
>
> References
>
> 1. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
> 2. mailto:william.redpath at lp.org
> 3. mailto:erin.adams at lp.org
> 4. https://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/03/29/magazine/29taxes-t.html
> 5. mailto:RealReform at earthlink.net
> 6. mailto:steven.nekhaila at lp.org
> 7. mailto:erin.adams at lp.org
> 8. https://mobile.nytimes.com/2009/03/29/magazine/29taxes-t.html
> 9. mailto:RealReform at earthlink.net
> 10. mailto:steven.nekhaila at lp.org
> 11. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
> 12. http://www.lpcolorado.org/
> 13. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
> 14. http://www.lpcolorado.org/
> 15. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
> 16. http://www.lpcolorado.org/
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