[Lnc-business] my audit of LNC At-Large election

Richard Longstreth richard.longstreth at lp.org
Thu Jul 12 21:31:15 EDT 2018


For what it's worth, I introduced the motion, not CAH or AM,  and I can
assure you that it isn't personal to either. Biyth of you co sponsored -
thank you. The move is about being a principled libertarian and treating
our internal elections as seriously as I would want our elections in the
trenches treated. That simple. I do see this narrative coming up over and
over and it bothers me because it distracts from the real intent of my
motion.

RTL

On Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 16:58 Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:

>    Alicia,
>    Here is where I think the issue keeps being lost.  None of this is
>    about you doing something wrong. None of this is about you at all but
>    about our process.  This keeps being personalized when it is not. In
>    assisting with the JC counts, a lot of errors were found in
>    transferring the ballots to the delegation sheets, so that is a
>    critical part of the audit.  In fact, to me, the most critical.
>    We have to ask ourselves if the answers we give ourselves here would be
>    satisfactory if this was one of our candidates.  And I submit they are
>    not.
>    But absolutely understood that you are extraordinarily busy.  The
>    ballots could be sent to me and I could scan them.  But it is all a
>    moot point unless the motion passes.
>    There is way too much defensiveness in a process that is not personal.
>    When I brought up the issue that Elizabeth brought up of delegation
>    chairs that were also candidates (or spouses of candidates) to some of
>    those people the reaction was "Oh my goodness, she is right!  That
>    should not be done in the future!"
>    This is not a battle between you and me and it seems like the narrative
>    is being put into that box.  It is not.  It is about our process.  The
>    fact that you have gotten organized results out of this process for so
>    long is a miracle and a testament to your data herding skills.  As more
>    people pay attention to what we actually do it is imperative that our
>    internal processes are much cleaner.  And on that point, I am
>    immovable.
>    -Caryn Ann
>
>    On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business
>    <[1]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>         Caryn Ann,
>         The specifics of the write-in votes are right there on the
>      delegation
>         tally sheets.
>         I'm not planning to spend even more time right now to scan 48
>      more sets
>         of individual ballots.  Staff is coming up on an LP News
>      deadline, and
>         I'm going to move on to other subjects today, with the first
>      being
>         getting the Platform updated so they can highlight the changes
>      for the
>         membership.  If the LNC wants a full independent audit and
>      additional
>         scanning is needed, that time investment can come later.  I'm
>      also
>         quickly approaching a policy deadline for the first draft of the
>      6/30
>         LNC minutes, so gotta do that, too.
>         I meant to make this point in my original transmission message,
>      but
>         keep in mind what numbers I can or can't influence in this
>      process.
>         The numbers originally written on the delegation tally sheets do
>      not
>         come from me.  They come from delegation chairs who believe those
>         numbers to represent the vote within that affiliate.  If I have
>         accurately moved that number from the tally sheet into the
>      spreadsheet,
>         then there's little reasonable complaint to be made.  For the
>      instance
>         in which the state's total for me needed a correction, I have
>      provided
>         the underlying individual ballots as backup evidence.  I have
>      done the
>         same for the changes that impact those near me in the rankings.
>      I knew
>         as soon as I provided the state-by-state breakdowns that even
>      further
>         down the ranking list on smaller changes, questions would exist
>      as to
>         why something is different than the tally sheet which was
>      submitted.
>         I've provided detailed explanations for those, and there's no
>      real
>         motive for me to tweak the 15th-ranked person by 1 vote (or
>      whatever)
>         if the data doesn't support that.  This should address most of
>      the
>         reasonable questions.
>         And for what it's worth, as I said on the list over the past
>      three
>         days, I was already building this and was about 95% done with it
>      before
>         the motion for an independent audit even arose.
>         -Alicia
>         On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:50 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
>         <[1][2]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
>         I am doing a brief perusal, this is some fantastic data parsing.
>      I am
>         curious why the write-ins are not noted specifically?
>         And as far as Zane Sarwark - minors can be sustaining members
>      with
>         their parents signing the pledge on their behalf, at least that
>      is what
>         I have been told and seen.  Is Zane a sustaining member? If not,
>      Nick
>         needs to get on that.  I do not think dead gorillas though can be
>         sustaining members so Harambe would be ineligible.  May he rest
>      in
>         peace.
>         Will the individual ballots for the other states also be provided
>         rather than just TX and CA?
>         -Caryn Ann
>         On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 1:38 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
>         <[2][3]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
>         Thank you.  I will alert the people who have been asking for
>      them.
>         This also answers Sam's questions as to how the sheets could be
>         transmitted - it is technologically trivial to scan them.
>         On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 1:17 AM, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business
>
>       <[3][4]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>            The At-Large tallies were made under the immense time pressures
>         of the
>            tail end of the convention, and as in past years, it is not
>         surprising
>            for a post-convention audit to find errors that were not caught
>         onsite.
>            For your reading pleasure, you can review the appendices of the
>         minutes
>            of the previous two conventions for my analyses of those  human
>         errors,
>            which take place even though people are acting in good faith.
>            None of the errors revealed by my audit of this year's At-Large
>         race
>            change the outcome. The top 5 people on July 3 remain the top 5
>            post-audit.
>            The largest single discrepancy was that the Colorado delegation
>         tally
>            sheet under-reported Joe Buchman by 5 votes.  His relative
>         ranking did
>            not change, though.
>            Attached is an Excel workbook with three sheets (or tabs):
>              * The first contains the state-by-state breakdown that
>         represents the
>                tallies exactly as released onsite on July 3.  You'll
>    notice
>         that
>                some cells are color-coded, and that's an indicator for you
>         to find
>                the related note at the bottom of that first tab to answer
>    a
>                potential question about that number. Each color has its
>    own
>                section of notes, with a header that explains the color
>         grouping.
>                White, green and yellow cells include values that did not
>         change in
>                the audited results.  The pink cells did change in the
>         audited
>                results for the reasons noted.
>              * The second tab contains the audited results, updated to
>         factor in
>                the issues in the pink cells.
>              * The third tab contains a comparison of the candidate
>    rankings
>                reported onsite on July 3 with the rankings for the audited
>                results. The variances are minor and do not change the top
>    5
>                finishers.
>            Also attached are the delegation tally sheets for comparison
>    with
>         the
>            details in the spreadsheet.  There are 50 sheets, rather than
>         51.  Not
>            present is the Wyoming sheet.  I don't know why that blank page
>         didn't
>            make it back into my collection, but Wyoming did not vote in
>    any
>         of the
>            elections, and you can see from the attached spreadsheet that
>    at
>         the
>            time of this vote they had 0 delegates credentialed.
>            The Mattson/Scheetz/Hayes cluster of candidates seems to be
>         attracting
>            the most interest, and the colored cells for that cluster of
>         candidates
>            involve the CA and TX ballots.  These are the two largest
>         delegations,
>            and they had the largest tallying task, which just gives more
>            opportunities for human error.  Immediately after sending this
>         message,
>            I'll follow up with another email which has the individual
>         ballots from
>            CA and TX attached for your tallying pleasure.  The size of the
>         scanned
>            files warrants two separate emails, else I'd include them here.
>         I
>            scanned in full color at 300 dpi so you can see them in all
>    their
>            glory.
>            -Alicia
>       --
>       --
>       In Liberty,
>       Caryn Ann Harlos
>       Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>
>         - [4]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>         Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>         A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>         We defend your rights
>         And oppose the use of force
>         Taxation is theft
>         --
>         --
>         In Liberty,
>         Caryn Ann Harlos
>         Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>         - [5]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>         Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>         A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>         We defend your rights
>         And oppose the use of force
>         Taxation is theft
>      References
>         1. mailto:[5]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>         2. mailto:[6]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>         3. mailto:[7]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>         4. mailto:[8]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>         5. mailto:[9]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>
>    --
>    --
>    In Liberty,
>    Caryn Ann Harlos
>    Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>    - [10]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>    Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>    A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>    We defend your rights
>    And oppose the use of force
>    Taxation is theft
>
> References
>
>    1. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>    2. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>    3. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>    4. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>    5. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>    6. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
>    7. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>    8. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>    9. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>   10. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>
-- 
Richard Longstreth
Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, KS, MT, NM, OR, HI, UT, WA, WY)
Libertarian National Committee
richard.longstreth at lp.org
931.538.9300
-------------- next part --------------
   For what it's worth, I introduced the motion, not CAH or AM,  and I can
   assure you that it isn't personal to either. Biyth of you co sponsored
   - thank you. The move is about being a principled libertarian and
   treating our internal elections as seriously as I would want our
   elections in the trenches treated. That simple. I do see this narrative
   coming up over and over and it bothers me because it distracts from the
   real intent of my motion.

   RTL

   On Thu, Jul 12, 2018, 16:58 Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
   <[1]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:

        Alicia,
        Here is where I think the issue keeps being lost.  None of this
     is
        about you doing something wrong. None of this is about you at all
     but
        about our process.  This keeps being personalized when it is not.
     In
        assisting with the JC counts, a lot of errors were found in
        transferring the ballots to the delegation sheets, so that is a
        critical part of the audit.  In fact, to me, the most critical.
        We have to ask ourselves if the answers we give ourselves here
     would be
        satisfactory if this was one of our candidates.  And I submit
     they are
        not.
        But absolutely understood that you are extraordinarily busy.  The
        ballots could be sent to me and I could scan them.  But it is all
     a
        moot point unless the motion passes.
        There is way too much defensiveness in a process that is not
     personal.
        When I brought up the issue that Elizabeth brought up of
     delegation
        chairs that were also candidates (or spouses of candidates) to
     some of
        those people the reaction was "Oh my goodness, she is right!
     That
        should not be done in the future!"
        This is not a battle between you and me and it seems like the
     narrative
        is being put into that box.  It is not.  It is about our
     process.  The
        fact that you have gotten organized results out of this process
     for so
        long is a miracle and a testament to your data herding skills.
     As more
        people pay attention to what we actually do it is imperative that
     our
        internal processes are much cleaner.  And on that point, I am
        immovable.
        -Caryn Ann
        On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:28 PM, Alicia Mattson via Lnc-business
        <[1][2]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
             Caryn Ann,
             The specifics of the write-in votes are right there on the
          delegation
             tally sheets.
             I'm not planning to spend even more time right now to scan
     48
          more sets
             of individual ballots.  Staff is coming up on an LP News
          deadline, and
             I'm going to move on to other subjects today, with the first
          being
             getting the Platform updated so they can highlight the
     changes
          for the
             membership.  If the LNC wants a full independent audit and
          additional
             scanning is needed, that time investment can come later.
     I'm
          also
             quickly approaching a policy deadline for the first draft of
     the
          6/30
             LNC minutes, so gotta do that, too.
             I meant to make this point in my original transmission
     message,
          but
             keep in mind what numbers I can or can't influence in this
          process.
             The numbers originally written on the delegation tally
     sheets do
          not
             come from me.  They come from delegation chairs who believe
     those
             numbers to represent the vote within that affiliate.  If I
     have
             accurately moved that number from the tally sheet into the
          spreadsheet,
             then there's little reasonable complaint to be made.  For
     the
          instance
             in which the state's total for me needed a correction, I
     have
          provided
             the underlying individual ballots as backup evidence.  I
     have
          done the
             same for the changes that impact those near me in the
     rankings.
          I knew
             as soon as I provided the state-by-state breakdowns that
     even
          further
             down the ranking list on smaller changes, questions would
     exist
          as to
             why something is different than the tally sheet which was
          submitted.
             I've provided detailed explanations for those, and there's
     no
          real
             motive for me to tweak the 15th-ranked person by 1 vote (or
          whatever)
             if the data doesn't support that.  This should address most
     of
          the
             reasonable questions.
             And for what it's worth, as I said on the list over the past
          three
             days, I was already building this and was about 95% done
     with it
          before
             the motion for an independent audit even arose.
             -Alicia
             On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 12:50 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
             <[1][2][3]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
             I am doing a brief perusal, this is some fantastic data
     parsing.
          I am
             curious why the write-ins are not noted specifically?
             And as far as Zane Sarwark - minors can be sustaining
     members
          with
             their parents signing the pledge on their behalf, at least
     that
          is what
             I have been told and seen.  Is Zane a sustaining member? If
     not,
          Nick
             needs to get on that.  I do not think dead gorillas though
     can be
             sustaining members so Harambe would be ineligible.  May he
     rest
          in
             peace.
             Will the individual ballots for the other states also be
     provided
             rather than just TX and CA?
             -Caryn Ann
             On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 1:38 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos
             <[2][3][4]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
             Thank you.  I will alert the people who have been asking for
          them.
             This also answers Sam's questions as to how the sheets could
     be
             transmitted - it is technologically trivial to scan them.
             On Thu, Jul 12, 2018 at 1:17 AM, Alicia Mattson via
     Lnc-business
           <[3][4][5]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
                The At-Large tallies were made under the immense time
     pressures
             of the
                tail end of the convention, and as in past years, it is
     not
             surprising
                for a post-convention audit to find errors that were not
     caught
             onsite.
                For your reading pleasure, you can review the appendices
     of the
             minutes
                of the previous two conventions for my analyses of those
     human
             errors,
                which take place even though people are acting in good
     faith.
                None of the errors revealed by my audit of this year's
     At-Large
             race
                change the outcome. The top 5 people on July 3 remain the
     top 5
                post-audit.
                The largest single discrepancy was that the Colorado
     delegation
             tally
                sheet under-reported Joe Buchman by 5 votes.  His
     relative
             ranking did
                not change, though.
                Attached is an Excel workbook with three sheets (or
     tabs):
                  * The first contains the state-by-state breakdown that
             represents the
                    tallies exactly as released onsite on July 3.  You'll
        notice
             that
                    some cells are color-coded, and that's an indicator
     for you
             to find
                    the related note at the bottom of that first tab to
     answer
        a
                    potential question about that number. Each color has
     its
        own
                    section of notes, with a header that explains the
     color
             grouping.
                    White, green and yellow cells include values that did
     not
             change in
                    the audited results.  The pink cells did change in
     the
             audited
                    results for the reasons noted.
                  * The second tab contains the audited results, updated
     to
             factor in
                    the issues in the pink cells.
                  * The third tab contains a comparison of the candidate
        rankings
                    reported onsite on July 3 with the rankings for the
     audited
                    results. The variances are minor and do not change
     the top
        5
                    finishers.
                Also attached are the delegation tally sheets for
     comparison
        with
             the
                details in the spreadsheet.  There are 50 sheets, rather
     than
             51.  Not
                present is the Wyoming sheet.  I don't know why that
     blank page
             didn't
                make it back into my collection, but Wyoming did not vote
     in
        any
             of the
                elections, and you can see from the attached spreadsheet
     that
        at
             the
                time of this vote they had 0 delegates credentialed.
                The Mattson/Scheetz/Hayes cluster of candidates seems to
     be
             attracting
                the most interest, and the colored cells for that cluster
     of
             candidates
                involve the CA and TX ballots.  These are the two largest
             delegations,
                and they had the largest tallying task, which just gives
     more
                opportunities for human error.  Immediately after sending
     this
             message,
                I'll follow up with another email which has the
     individual
             ballots from
                CA and TX attached for your tallying pleasure.  The size
     of the
             scanned
                files warrants two separate emails, else I'd include them
     here.
             I
                scanned in full color at 300 dpi so you can see them in
     all
        their
                glory.
                -Alicia
           --
           --
           In Liberty,
           Caryn Ann Harlos
           Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
             - [4]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
             Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
             A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
             We defend your rights
             And oppose the use of force
             Taxation is theft
             --
             --
             In Liberty,
             Caryn Ann Harlos
             Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
     Secretary
             - [5]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
             Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
             A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
             We defend your rights
             And oppose the use of force
             Taxation is theft
          References
             1. mailto:[5][6]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
             2. mailto:[6][7]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
             3. mailto:[7][8]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
             4. mailto:[8]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
             5. mailto:[9]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
        --
        --
        In Liberty,
        Caryn Ann Harlos
        Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
        - [10]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
        Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
        A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
        We defend your rights
        And oppose the use of force
        Taxation is theft
     References
        1. mailto:[9]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
        2. mailto:[10]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
        3. mailto:[11]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
        4. mailto:[12]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
        5. mailto:[13]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
        6. mailto:[14]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
        7. mailto:[15]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
        8. mailto:[16]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
        9. mailto:[17]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
       10. mailto:[18]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org

   --

   Richard Longstreth
   Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, KS, MT, NM, OR, HI, UT, WA, WY)
   Libertarian National Committee
   [19]richard.longstreth at lp.org
   931.538.9300

References

   1. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
   2. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
   3. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
   4. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
   5. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
   6. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
   7. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
   8. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
   9. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
  10. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
  11. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
  12. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
  13. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
  14. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
  15. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
  16. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
  17. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
  18. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
  19. mailto:richard.longstreth at lp.org


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