[Lnc-business] Email Ballot 2018-19: AGREE TO "JC" DECISIONS
Sam Goldstein
sam.goldstein at lp.org
Tue Jul 31 11:47:05 EDT 2018
So it just takes a majority of those voting to pass this motion which is
well less than 50% of the LNC at this time. I think that would be a
horrible precedent to set, especially for such an important subject.
This is a very bad idea and should have been open to a debate at our
next meeting. There is nothing urgent confronting the LNC at this point
that would require a pretend JC with no actual Bylaws authority or
enforcement ability.
Please vote No and let's talk about the situation next month.
Live Free,
---
Sam Goldstein
Libertarian National Committee
317-850-0726 Cell
On 2018-07-31 10:02, Tim Hagan via Lnc-business wrote:
> I vote yes.
>
> In practice this is very similar to the idea of an Appeals Committee.
> Seems to be the best solution to the situation that the convention
> delegates created.
>
> ---
> Tim Hagan
> Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
>
> On 2018-07-31 04:58, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>> REMINDER - This ballot will expire on AUGUST 1, 2018.
>>
>> I have noted the following (please inform me of any corrections):
>>
>> Voting AYE: Harlos, Longstreth, Merced, Nekhaila, Olsen, Phillips
>>
>> Voting NAY: Goldstein, Lyons
>>
>> Express Abstentions: None
>>
>> Not Voting: Bilyeu/Adams, Bishop-Henchman, Hagan, Lark/Hogarth,
>> Mattson, Redpath, Sarwark, Smith, Van Horn/Nanna
>>
>> For a current tally of 6-2.
>>
>> Notes: Region 8 Representative Hewitt has not voted so Alternate
>> Olsen's vote stands.
>>
>> You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally of votes here:
>> https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 27, 2018 at 1:09 PM, Jeff Lyons via Lnc-business
>> <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>> On 2018-07-25 20:40, Alex Merced (LNC Vice Chair) via Lnc-business
>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>> I vote yes, from my understanding this does not appoint them as the
>>>> judicial committee which if successfully elected by delegates we’d
>>>> be
>>>> bound to follow.
>>>>
>>>> Instead this just says the LNC will voluntarily bind itself to the
>>>> decisions of the top 7 vote getters in matters in which a JC would
>>>> operate.
>>>>
>>>> This seems to me an effort to self-regulate in a spirit that Best
>>>> represents an effort to represent the wishes of the delegation to
>>>> the
>>>> extent such can be discernible with the existing votes.
>>>>
>>>> This motion does not say they are the JC but just that we will hold
>>>> their deliberations voluntarily binding in same way we’d be
>>>> mandatorily bound had they’d successfully been elected.
>>>>
>>>> An unfortunate compromise, but the best one I’ve seen. It isn’t the
>>>> LNC Creating new powers but voluntarily putting a back stop on its
>>>> existing ones temporarily since no other backstops exist formally
>>>> for
>>>> the time being.
>>>>
>>>> Alex Merced
>>>> Vice Chair of the Libertarian National Committee/LP
>>>>
>>>>> On Jul 25, 2018, at 2:12 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
>>>>> <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> It is better than having zero protection at all for the members.
>>>>> And
>>>>> IF after making this agreement, anyone who voted to then renege I
>>>>> would hope would not be re-elected. This "JC" has already
>>>>> submitted
>>>>> it appellate rules.
>>>>>
>>>>> Our Party structure NEVER imagined an unaccountable LNC.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Jul 25, 2018 at 12:05 PM, Sam Goldstein
>>>>>> <sam.goldstein at lp.org>
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> I vote No on this motion.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> 1. The Bylaws are clear that only delegates at convention can
>>>>>> elect the
>>>>>> Judicial Committee
>>>>>> 2. The Top Seven mentioned in this motion were not approved by
>>>>>> margins
>>>>>> of at
>>>>>> least 60% of the
>>>>>> delegates so would not meet the precedent set by the last JC of
>>>>>> requiring
>>>>>> a majority approval of delegates
>>>>>> 3. There is no provision in either the Bylaws or Policy Manual of
>>>>>> how
>>>>>> this
>>>>>> pretend JC would function, whether it
>>>>>> would follow Appellate rules set by the last JC or would dream
>>>>>> up its'
>>>>>> own rules that this motion would
>>>>>> have the LNC be bound to follow
>>>>>> 4. This has essentially already been rejected by the LNC per the
>>>>>> motion
>>>>>> to
>>>>>> recognize the Top Seven as the JC (which I voted
>>>>>> in favor of but have reconsidered)
>>>>>>
>>>>>> Please consider my points before you vote on this motion. The
>>>>>> entire
>>>>>> purpose of the Judicial Committee is to have a body
>>>>>> that is not beholden to the LNC. There is no guarantee that if
>>>>>> the
>>>>>> pretend
>>>>>> JC makes a decision objectionable to the LNC that
>>>>>> the LNC cannot just reverse this motion by a majority vote.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> ---
>>>>>> Sam Goldstein
>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>> 317-850-0726 Cell
>>>>>>
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> On 2018-07-25 13:23, Craig Bowden via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Yes
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Craig Bowden
>>>>>>> Region 1 Alternate
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> On 2018-07-25 06:06, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> We have an electronic mail ballot. Votes are due to the
>>>>>>>> LNC-Business
>>>>>>>> list by AUGUST 1, 2018 at 11:59:59pm Pacific time.
>>>>>>>> Co-Sponsors:
>>>>>>>> Harlos,
>>>>>>>> Longstreth, Merced, Phillips Motion: Move that the Libertarian
>>>>>>>> National
>>>>>>>> Committee agree to be bound by the decisions of the top-seven
>>>>>>>> vote-getters for the Judicial Committee at the 2018 Convention
>>>>>>>> as if
>>>>>>>> they were elected in the normal course of convention business
>>>>>>>> and
>>>>>>>> follow the procedures and rules set forth in our Bylaws. It is
>>>>>>>> acknowledged that this agreement is not binding upon any
>>>>>>>> member or
>>>>>>>> affiliate. You can keep track of the Secretary's manual tally
>>>>>>>> of
>>>>>>>> votes
>>>>>>>> here: [1]https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>>> In Liberty,
>>>>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>>>>>>>> -
>>>>>>>> [2]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>>>>>> We defend your rights
>>>>>>>> And oppose the use of force
>>>>>>>> Taxation is theft
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> References
>>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>> 1. https://tinyurl.com/lncvoting
>>>>>>>> 2. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> --
>>>>> In Liberty,
>>>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>>>> We defend your rights
>>>>> And oppose the use of force
>>>>> Taxation is theft
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> I could get behind this solution, once we ensure this never happens
>>> again.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> --
>>> In Liberty,
>>> Jeff Lyons
>>>
>>> Region 8 Alternate
>>> (Acting Region 8 Rep)
>>>
>>> Libertarian Assoc. of MA
>>> Membership Director
>>> http://www.lpmass.org/join
>>>
>>> Daniel Fishman for Auditor
>>> Campaign Manager
>>> http://www.AuditMassachusetts.com
>>>
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> In Liberty,
>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary -
>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>
>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> We defend your rights
>> And oppose the use of force
>> Taxation is theft
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