[Lnc-business] Seeking Co-Sponsors for Resolution to Re-Affirm The LP's Stance For Property Rights
Caryn Ann Harlos
caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
Tue Aug 14 18:52:00 EDT 2018
So are you saying members who appreciate clarification are lacking in
intelligence?
Of course you aren’t. But that is what that implies.
Explicating our Platform is not everyone’s thing.
-Caryn Ann
On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 4:45 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
wrote:
> Exactly.
>
> I mean - is this policy part of our diversity?
>
>
> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 4:36 PM Justin O'Donnell via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> How can we promote practical solutions to our ideological platform if we
>> can't even agree on the fundamentals of our ideological platform?
>>
>> ---
>> Yours in Liberty,
>>
>> Justin O'Donnell
>> LNC Region 8 Representative
>> LPNH Alternate- LNC Platform Committee
>> Chair- LPNH Platform Committee
>> Candidate for US Congress, NH-2
>> www.odonnell2018.org
>>
>> On 2018-08-14 18:34, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business wrote:
>> > Jeff, thank you! Well said. You've articulated the position of the
>> > caucus I belong to.
>> > -------------------
>> > We even say:
>> >
>> > "We celebrate our ideological diversity.
>> >
>> > AS LIBERTARIANS, WE'RE NOT GOING TO AGREE ON EVERYTHING - AND THAT'S
>> > OK!
>> > What we can agree on:
>> >
>> > We need to elect Libertarians to state and local public office.
>> > We need to promote practical solutions to our ideological platform."
>> > -----------------
>> >
>> > Cheers,
>> > EVH
>> > ---
>> > Elizabeth Van Horn
>> >
>> >
>> > On 2018-08-14 18:07, Jeff Lyons wrote:
>> >> Good Afternoon,
>> >>
>> >> There are a bunch of different threads on this whole property
>> >> rights vs. libsoc thing. I don't get where these discussions are
>> >> going, I'm not going to go through it and as an Alternate my vote
>> >> won't decide anything anyways. I just think this is a completely
>> >> fruitless effort, a waste of time, and of brainpower.
>> >>
>> >> Some Libertarians have good ideas, some have bad ideas. The
>> >> answer is MORE speech, more dialogue, more ideas, and the good ideas
>> >> will always win eventually. People are smart enough to decide for
>> >> themselves if socialism can be voluntary or if property should be
>> >> personally / privately owned. Let them debate it all they want. I
>> >> don't think anyone who can't make a serious case for whatever their
>> >> ideology is will last long before they learn something new and
>> >> inevitably evolve their position. Libertarians don't have to agree on
>> >> everything and I don't think we should bother trying to force them to
>> >> get along. The people will figure it out on their own, through their
>> >> discussions.
>> >>
>> >> I respectfully disagree there is even a need for US to have this
>> >> discussion and vote no on whatever the resolution is because I don't
>> >> think we really need one. At all. Ever. That's not our job.
>> >>
>> >> --
>> >> In Liberty,
>> >> Jeff Lyons
>> >>
>> >> Region 8 Alternate
>> >> (Acting Region 8 Rep)
>> >>
>> >> Libertarian Assoc. of MA
>> >> Membership Director
>> >> http://www.lpmass.org/join
>> >>
>> >> Daniel Fishman for Auditor
>> >> Campaign Manager
>> >> http://www.AuditMassachusetts.com
>> >>
>> >>
>> >>
>> >> On 2018-08-14 15:37, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business wrote:
>> >>> BS.
>> >>> (all about brevity ; )
>> >>>
>> >>> ---
>> >>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>> >>>
>> >>> On 2018-08-14 15:34, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> The brevity caucus keeps the exegesis of our Platform out.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> It becomes necessary to apply and explicate.
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> -Caryn Ann
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>>
>> >>> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 1:29 PM Elizabeth Van Horn via
>> >>> Lnc-business
>> >>> <[1]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>> >>>
>> >>> Then why not a resolution saying that the LNC stands in support
>> >>> of
>> >>> our
>> >>> LP platform? Because, I think it's pretty obvious that we do.
>> >>> (Although, I know that the Radical caucus, Mises caucus, and
>> >>> libsocs,
>> >>> all have their *own* platforms. I support our LP platform, and
>> >>> that's a
>> >>> founding point of the caucus I'm in, that we don't have a
>> >>> separate
>> >>> platform, we instead embrace the LP platform.
>> >>> Do all the board members in various caucuses want to come out in
>> >>> favor
>> >>> of the *LP Platform*? I like to see that resolution.
>> >>> ---
>> >>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>> >>> On 2018-08-14 15:07, Justin O'Donnell via Lnc-business wrote:
>> >>> > This resolution is an affirmation of that platform and it's
>> >>> underlying
>> >>> > principles. It serves simply to acknowledge rhetoric contrary
>> >>> to
>> >>> our
>> >>> > platform and affirm that the Libertarian Party stands by the
>> >>> messaging
>> >>> > and platform adopted by it's delegates in convention, as
>> >>> opposed
>> >>> to
>> >>> > those who would argue otherwise. It does not purge anyone, but
>> >>> simply
>> >>> > distances the LP from their economic views. They are members,
>> >>> and
>> >>> many
>> >>> > will remain so, but the resolution is to affirm that their
>> >>> outspoken
>> >>> > beliefs do not represent the party as a whole. Some of these
>> >>> > individual members are even candidates in profiled races,
>> >>> where
>> >>> they
>> >>> > are espousing ideas contrary to our platform, and it is
>> >>> incumbent
>> >>> upon
>> >>> > this body to recognize that this is a risk to the integrity of
>> >>> our
>> >>> > messaging. An individual or a candidate may proclaim whatever
>> >>> platform
>> >>> > they wish, but when they claim that it is representative of
>> >>> > Libertarian Ideology when it is clearly contrary to our
>> >>> platform
>> >>> and
>> >>> > statement of principles, it requires an acknowledgement from
>> >>> the
>> >>> LNC.
>> >>> >
>> >>> > ---
>> >>> > Yours in Liberty,
>> >>> >
>> >>> > Justin O'Donnell
>> >>> > LNC Region 8 Representative
>> >>> > LPNH Alternate- LNC Platform Committee
>> >>> > Chair- LPNH Platform Committee
>> >>> > Candidate for US Congress, NH-2
>> >>> > [2]www.odonnell2018.org
>> >>> >
>> >>> > On 2018-08-14 15:01, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> >> We have a platform that states what we stand for, and you
>> >>> were
>> >>> the
>> >>> >> platform committee chair for 2018. I was on that
>> >>> committee,
>> >>> as
>> >>> >> were
>> >>> >> several other members of this board.
>> >>> >> Did we not do our duty? Did we leave the platform to be
>> >>> ambiguous
>> >>> >> and
>> >>> >> confusing? I don't think so.
>> >>> >> Our wonderful LP platform speaks for the LP, and tells
>> >>> prospective
>> >>> >> members where we stand. We educate from that document,
>> >>> and I
>> >>> know
>> >>> >> that you understand this, as you were instrumental in
>> >>> doing
>> >>> >> platform
>> >>> >> plank posts on social media. You know that the platform
>> >>> speaks for
>> >>> >> us
>> >>> >> on issues of property rights.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> ---
>> >>> >> Elizabeth Van Horn
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> On 2018-08-14 14:55, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> It is quite problematic that stating the Party's
>> >>> foundational
>> >>> >> Principles is controversial or thought to need a platform
>> >>> change.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> We have gone far from our roots.
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> -Caryn Ann
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 12:51 PM Elizabeth Van Horn via
>> >>> >> Lnc-business
>> >>> >> <[1][3]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> I also would have supported the first effort (with my
>> >>> language
>> >>> >> changes)
>> >>> >> as it was a clear support of capitalism. Too bad that
>> >>> wasn't
>> >>> >> embraced.
>> >>> >> On this list I've seen multiple times someone talk about
>> >>> past
>> >>> >> actions as
>> >>> >> a reason, (we denounced that, so why not this?) the more
>> >>> times I
>> >>> >> see,
>> >>> >> the more this looks like a grudge match.
>> >>> >> As the players in this drama, and yes it's a big drama
>> >>> on
>> >>> social
>> >>> >> media,
>> >>> >> are ones that have had an ongoing war-of-words with the
>> >>> targets
>> >>> >> of
>> >>> >> this
>> >>> >> suggested resolution. Only, some of the players also
>> >>> happen
>> >>> to
>> >>> >> be
>> >>> >> on
>> >>> >> the LNC, and are now using that position to escalate.
>> >>> >> I was willing to support a resolution that embraced
>> >>> capitalism,
>> >>> >> as I
>> >>> >> live my life as a capitalist. It is my economic system
>> >>> of
>> >>> choice,
>> >>> >> and I
>> >>> >> make an effort to teach this to others.
>> >>> >> Too bad this isn't about championing the wonderful
>> >>> economic
>> >>> >> system
>> >>> >> of
>> >>> >> capitalism, but instead is about targeting a few noisy
>> >>> LP
>> >>> >> members.
>> >>> >> ---
>> >>> >> Elizabeth Van Horn
>> >>> >> On 2018-08-14 14:26, john.phillips--- via Lnc-business
>> >>> wrote:
>> >>> >> > This is not the same language as was presented and
>> >>> discussed
>> >>> >> earlier.
>> >>> >> > Just to clarify for people who may just be
>> >>> skimming.
>> >>> >> > I probably would have gone along with the first.
>> >>> This
>> >>> one
>> >>> >> is
>> >>> >> toxic
>> >>> >> > and
>> >>> >> > the language clearly meant to be be a purge.
>> >>> >> > If it was just a supporting of property rights I
>> >>> would
>> >>> >> absolutely
>> >>> >> > support it. This is far more than that, and
>> >>> honestly
>> >>> far
>> >>> >> exceeds
>> >>> >> > the
>> >>> >> > scope of the duties of this body. It is a direct
>> >>> change to
>> >>> >> policy
>> >>> >> > seriously impacts current members and activists.
>> >>> >> > If you want a platform change take it to Austin.
>> >>> That
>> >>> is not
>> >>> >> our
>> >>> >> > job.
>> >>> >> > I will be voting no on this, and urge everyone else
>> >>> to
>> >>> >> seriously
>> >>> >> > consider whether they support a precedent of
>> >>> purging
>> >>> groups.
>> >>> >> Not to
>> >>> >> > mention how many of you during the JC discussion
>> >>> were
>> >>> >> treading
>> >>> >> very
>> >>> >> > carefully about not exceeding our scope, a point
>> >>> that
>> >>> was
>> >>> >> well
>> >>> >> taken
>> >>> >> > after reflection, will you be consistent here?
>> >>> >> > John Phillips
>> >>> >> > Libertarian National Committee Region 6
>> >>> Representative
>> >>> >> > Cell [1]217-412-5973
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > ------ Original message------
>> >>> >> > From: Steven Nekhaila via Lnc-business
>> >>> >> > Date: Tue, Aug 14, 2018 10:50 AM
>> >>> >> > To: LNC-Business List;
>> >>> >> > Cc: Steven Nekhaila;
>> >>> >> > Subject:[Lnc-business] Seeking Co-Sponsors for
>> >>> Resolution to
>> >>> >> > Re-Affirm
>> >>> >> > The LP's Stance For Property Rights
>> >>> >> > Dear Colleagues,
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > I invite you to co-sponsor the following resolution
>> >>> which
>> >>> >> disavows
>> >>> >> > socialist & communist policies and re-affirms the
>> >>> Libertarian
>> >>> >> Party
>> >>> >> > position on championing property rights.
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > Co-Sponsors: Joshua Smith, Justin O'Donnel, and Caryn
>> >>> Ann
>> >>> >> Harlos
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > WHEREAS, the Libertarian Party supports the free
>> >>> market
>> >>> and
>> >>> >> therefore
>> >>> >> > the right of privatization of property as an extension
>> >>> of
>> >>> the
>> >>> >> > individual;
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > WHEREAS, the Statement of Principles of The
>> >>> Libertarian
>> >>> Party
>> >>> >> > explicitly
>> >>> >> > supports the right to private property ownership,
>> >>> including the
>> >>> >> right
>> >>> >> > to
>> >>> >> > do business utilizing that property as capital;
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > WHEREAS, the Libertarian Party strongly supports the
>> >>> rights of
>> >>> >> > individuals to own private property including land,
>> >>> structures,
>> >>> >> natural
>> >>> >> > resources and other private space through
>> >>> homesteading,
>> >>> >> purchase,
>> >>> >> and
>> >>> >> > other lawful libertarian means;
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > WHEREAS, ownership of private property, including but
>> >>> not
>> >>> >> limited
>> >>> >> to
>> >>> >> > land and housing, does not require continual or
>> >>> personal
>> >>> use to
>> >>> >> exist
>> >>> >> > as
>> >>> >> > justly owned property unless otherwise abandoned;
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > WHEREAS, these have been part of the principles of the
>> >>> >> Libertarian
>> >>> >> > Party
>> >>> >> > since its inception;
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that socialist and
>> >>> communist
>> >>> >> property
>> >>> >> > ownership schemes, including the collectivization of
>> >>> property,
>> >>> >> unlawful
>> >>> >> > usurpation of property, and incorrect
>> >>> characterizations of
>> >>> >> private
>> >>> >> > property, unless otherwise voluntarily agreed by all
>> >>> parties,
>> >>> >> are
>> >>> >> > incompatible with the philosophy of the Libertarian
>> >>> Party.
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > In Liberty,
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > Steven Nekhaila
>> >>> >> > Region 2 Representative
>> >>> >> > Libertarian National Committee
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > Impotentes defendere libertatum non possunt
>> >>> >> > "Those without power cannot defend freedom"
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > References
>> >>> >> >
>> >>> >> > 1. tel:217-412-5973
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> --
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> --
>> >>> >> In Liberty,
>> >>> >> Caryn Ann Harlos
>> >>> >> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
>> >>> Secretary
>> >>> >> - [2]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>> >>> >> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee -
>> >>> LPedia at LP.org
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> >>> >> We defend your rights
>> >>> >> And oppose the use of force
>> >>> >> Taxation is theft
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> References
>> >>> >>
>> >>> >> 1. mailto:[4]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> >>> >> 2. mailto:[5]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>>
>> >>> --
>> >>> In Liberty,
>> >>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>> >>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>> >>> - [6]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>> >>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>> >>>
>> >>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>> >>> We defend your rights
>> >>> And oppose the use of force
>> >>> Taxation is theft
>> >>>
>> >>> References
>> >>>
>> >>> 1. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> >>> 2. http://www.odonnell2018.org/
>> >>> 3. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> >>> 4. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>> >>> 5. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>> >>> 6. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>
> --
> --
> *In Liberty,*
> *Caryn Ann Harlos*
> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary - Caryn.Ann.
> Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>
> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
> *We defend your rights*
> *And oppose the use of force*
> *Taxation is theft*
>
--
--
*In Liberty,*
*Caryn Ann Harlos*
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary - Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
*We defend your rights*
*And oppose the use of force*
*Taxation is theft*
-------------- next part --------------
So are you saying members who appreciate clarification are lacking in
intelligence?
Of course you aren’t. But that is what that implies.
Explicating our Platform is not everyone’s thing.
-Caryn Ann
On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 4:45 PM Caryn Ann Harlos
<[1]caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org> wrote:
Exactly.
I mean - is this policy part of our diversity?
[cid:1653a9dd1c7d299af1d1]
On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 4:36 PM Justin O'Donnell via Lnc-business
<[2]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
How can we promote practical solutions to our ideological platform
if we
can't even agree on the fundamentals of our ideological platform?
---
Yours in Liberty,
Justin O'Donnell
LNC Region 8 Representative
LPNH Alternate- LNC Platform Committee
Chair- LPNH Platform Committee
Candidate for US Congress, NH-2
[3]www.odonnell2018.org
On 2018-08-14 18:34, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business wrote:
> Jeff, thank you! Well said. You've articulated the position of
the
> caucus I belong to.
> -------------------
> We even say:
>
> "We celebrate our ideological diversity.
>
> AS LIBERTARIANS, WE'RE NOT GOING TO AGREE ON EVERYTHING - AND
THAT'S
> OK!
> What we can agree on:
>
> We need to elect Libertarians to state and local public office.
> We need to promote practical solutions to our ideological
platform."
> -----------------
>
> Cheers,
> EVH
> ---
> Elizabeth Van Horn
>
>
> On 2018-08-14 18:07, Jeff Lyons wrote:
>> Good Afternoon,
>>
>> There are a bunch of different threads on this whole
property
>> rights vs. libsoc thing. I don't get where these discussions are
>> going, I'm not going to go through it and as an Alternate my vote
>> won't decide anything anyways. I just think this is a completely
>> fruitless effort, a waste of time, and of brainpower.
>>
>> Some Libertarians have good ideas, some have bad ideas. The
>> answer is MORE speech, more dialogue, more ideas, and the good
ideas
>> will always win eventually. People are smart enough to decide
for
>> themselves if socialism can be voluntary or if property should be
>> personally / privately owned. Let them debate it all they want.
I
>> don't think anyone who can't make a serious case for whatever
their
>> ideology is will last long before they learn something new and
>> inevitably evolve their position. Libertarians don't have to
agree on
>> everything and I don't think we should bother trying to force
them to
>> get along. The people will figure it out on their own, through
their
>> discussions.
>>
>> I respectfully disagree there is even a need for US to have
this
>> discussion and vote no on whatever the resolution is because I
don't
>> think we really need one. At all. Ever. That's not our job.
>>
>> --
>> In Liberty,
>> Jeff Lyons
>>
>> Region 8 Alternate
>> (Acting Region 8 Rep)
>>
>> Libertarian Assoc. of MA
>> Membership Director
>> [4]http://www.lpmass.org/join
>>
>> Daniel Fishman for Auditor
>> Campaign Manager
>> [5]http://www.AuditMassachusetts.com
>>
>>
>>
>> On 2018-08-14 15:37, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business wrote:
>>> BS.
>>> (all about brevity ; )
>>>
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>>
>>> On 2018-08-14 15:34, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>>
>>> The brevity caucus keeps the exegesis of our Platform out.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> It becomes necessary to apply and explicate.
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>
>>>
>>>
>>> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 1:29 PM Elizabeth Van Horn via
>>> Lnc-business
>>> <[1][6]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>
>>> Then why not a resolution saying that the LNC stands in
support
>>> of
>>> our
>>> LP platform? Because, I think it's pretty obvious that we
do.
>>> (Although, I know that the Radical caucus, Mises caucus,
and
>>> libsocs,
>>> all have their *own* platforms. I support our LP platform,
and
>>> that's a
>>> founding point of the caucus I'm in, that we don't have a
>>> separate
>>> platform, we instead embrace the LP platform.
>>> Do all the board members in various caucuses want to come
out in
>>> favor
>>> of the *LP Platform*? I like to see that resolution.
>>> ---
>>> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> On 2018-08-14 15:07, Justin O'Donnell via Lnc-business
wrote:
>>> > This resolution is an affirmation of that platform and
it's
>>> underlying
>>> > principles. It serves simply to acknowledge rhetoric
contrary
>>> to
>>> our
>>> > platform and affirm that the Libertarian Party stands by
the
>>> messaging
>>> > and platform adopted by it's delegates in convention, as
>>> opposed
>>> to
>>> > those who would argue otherwise. It does not purge
anyone, but
>>> simply
>>> > distances the LP from their economic views. They are
members,
>>> and
>>> many
>>> > will remain so, but the resolution is to affirm that
their
>>> outspoken
>>> > beliefs do not represent the party as a whole. Some of
these
>>> > individual members are even candidates in profiled races,
>>> where
>>> they
>>> > are espousing ideas contrary to our platform, and it is
>>> incumbent
>>> upon
>>> > this body to recognize that this is a risk to the
integrity of
>>> our
>>> > messaging. An individual or a candidate may proclaim
whatever
>>> platform
>>> > they wish, but when they claim that it is representative
of
>>> > Libertarian Ideology when it is clearly contrary to our
>>> platform
>>> and
>>> > statement of principles, it requires an acknowledgement
from
>>> the
>>> LNC.
>>> >
>>> > ---
>>> > Yours in Liberty,
>>> >
>>> > Justin O'Donnell
>>> > LNC Region 8 Representative
>>> > LPNH Alternate- LNC Platform Committee
>>> > Chair- LPNH Platform Committee
>>> > Candidate for US Congress, NH-2
>>> > [2][7]www.odonnell2018.org
>>> >
>>> > On 2018-08-14 15:01, Elizabeth Van Horn via Lnc-business
>>> wrote:
>>> >> We have a platform that states what we stand for, and
you
>>> were
>>> the
>>> >> platform committee chair for 2018. I was on that
>>> committee,
>>> as
>>> >> were
>>> >> several other members of this board.
>>> >> Did we not do our duty? Did we leave the platform to
be
>>> ambiguous
>>> >> and
>>> >> confusing? I don't think so.
>>> >> Our wonderful LP platform speaks for the LP, and
tells
>>> prospective
>>> >> members where we stand. We educate from that
document,
>>> and I
>>> know
>>> >> that you understand this, as you were instrumental in
>>> doing
>>> >> platform
>>> >> plank posts on social media. You know that the
platform
>>> speaks for
>>> >> us
>>> >> on issues of property rights.
>>> >>
>>> >> ---
>>> >> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> >>
>>> >> On 2018-08-14 14:55, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> It is quite problematic that stating the Party's
>>> foundational
>>> >> Principles is controversial or thought to need a
platform
>>> change.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> We have gone far from our roots.
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> -Caryn Ann
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >>
>>> >> On Tue, Aug 14, 2018 at 12:51 PM Elizabeth Van Horn
via
>>> >> Lnc-business
>>> >> <[1][3][8]lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>> >>
>>> >> I also would have supported the first effort (with
my
>>> language
>>> >> changes)
>>> >> as it was a clear support of capitalism. Too bad
that
>>> wasn't
>>> >> embraced.
>>> >> On this list I've seen multiple times someone talk
about
>>> past
>>> >> actions as
>>> >> a reason, (we denounced that, so why not this?) the
more
>>> times I
>>> >> see,
>>> >> the more this looks like a grudge match.
>>> >> As the players in this drama, and yes it's a big
drama
>>> on
>>> social
>>> >> media,
>>> >> are ones that have had an ongoing war-of-words with
the
>>> targets
>>> >> of
>>> >> this
>>> >> suggested resolution. Only, some of the players
also
>>> happen
>>> to
>>> >> be
>>> >> on
>>> >> the LNC, and are now using that position to
escalate.
>>> >> I was willing to support a resolution that embraced
>>> capitalism,
>>> >> as I
>>> >> live my life as a capitalist. It is my economic
system
>>> of
>>> choice,
>>> >> and I
>>> >> make an effort to teach this to others.
>>> >> Too bad this isn't about championing the wonderful
>>> economic
>>> >> system
>>> >> of
>>> >> capitalism, but instead is about targeting a few
noisy
>>> LP
>>> >> members.
>>> >> ---
>>> >> Elizabeth Van Horn
>>> >> On 2018-08-14 14:26, john.phillips--- via
Lnc-business
>>> wrote:
>>> >> > This is not the same language as was presented
and
>>> discussed
>>> >> earlier.
>>> >> > Just to clarify for people who may just be
>>> skimming.
>>> >> > I probably would have gone along with the
first.
>>> This
>>> one
>>> >> is
>>> >> toxic
>>> >> > and
>>> >> > the language clearly meant to be be a purge.
>>> >> > If it was just a supporting of property rights
I
>>> would
>>> >> absolutely
>>> >> > support it. This is far more than that, and
>>> honestly
>>> far
>>> >> exceeds
>>> >> > the
>>> >> > scope of the duties of this body. It is a
direct
>>> change to
>>> >> policy
>>> >> > seriously impacts current members and
activists.
>>> >> > If you want a platform change take it to
Austin.
>>> That
>>> is not
>>> >> our
>>> >> > job.
>>> >> > I will be voting no on this, and urge everyone
else
>>> to
>>> >> seriously
>>> >> > consider whether they support a precedent of
>>> purging
>>> groups.
>>> >> Not to
>>> >> > mention how many of you during the JC
discussion
>>> were
>>> >> treading
>>> >> very
>>> >> > carefully about not exceeding our scope, a
point
>>> that
>>> was
>>> >> well
>>> >> taken
>>> >> > after reflection, will you be consistent here?
>>> >> > John Phillips
>>> >> > Libertarian National Committee Region 6
>>> Representative
>>> >> > Cell [1]217-412-5973
>>> >> >
>>> >> > ------ Original message------
>>> >> > From: Steven Nekhaila via Lnc-business
>>> >> > Date: Tue, Aug 14, 2018 10:50 AM
>>> >> > To: LNC-Business List;
>>> >> > Cc: Steven Nekhaila;
>>> >> > Subject:[Lnc-business] Seeking Co-Sponsors for
>>> Resolution to
>>> >> > Re-Affirm
>>> >> > The LP's Stance For Property Rights
>>> >> > Dear Colleagues,
>>> >> >
>>> >> > I invite you to co-sponsor the following
resolution
>>> which
>>> >> disavows
>>> >> > socialist & communist policies and re-affirms the
>>> Libertarian
>>> >> Party
>>> >> > position on championing property rights.
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Co-Sponsors: Joshua Smith, Justin O'Donnel, and
Caryn
>>> Ann
>>> >> Harlos
>>> >> >
>>> >> > WHEREAS, the Libertarian Party supports the free
>>> market
>>> and
>>> >> therefore
>>> >> > the right of privatization of property as an
extension
>>> of
>>> the
>>> >> > individual;
>>> >> >
>>> >> > WHEREAS, the Statement of Principles of The
>>> Libertarian
>>> Party
>>> >> > explicitly
>>> >> > supports the right to private property ownership,
>>> including the
>>> >> right
>>> >> > to
>>> >> > do business utilizing that property as capital;
>>> >> >
>>> >> > WHEREAS, the Libertarian Party strongly supports
the
>>> rights of
>>> >> > individuals to own private property including
land,
>>> structures,
>>> >> natural
>>> >> > resources and other private space through
>>> homesteading,
>>> >> purchase,
>>> >> and
>>> >> > other lawful libertarian means;
>>> >> >
>>> >> > WHEREAS, ownership of private property, including
but
>>> not
>>> >> limited
>>> >> to
>>> >> > land and housing, does not require continual or
>>> personal
>>> use to
>>> >> exist
>>> >> > as
>>> >> > justly owned property unless otherwise abandoned;
>>> >> >
>>> >> > WHEREAS, these have been part of the principles
of the
>>> >> Libertarian
>>> >> > Party
>>> >> > since its inception;
>>> >> >
>>> >> > THEREFORE, BE IT RESOLVED, that socialist and
>>> communist
>>> >> property
>>> >> > ownership schemes, including the collectivization
of
>>> property,
>>> >> unlawful
>>> >> > usurpation of property, and incorrect
>>> characterizations of
>>> >> private
>>> >> > property, unless otherwise voluntarily agreed by
all
>>> parties,
>>> >> are
>>> >> > incompatible with the philosophy of the
Libertarian
>>> Party.
>>> >> >
>>> >> >
>>> >> > In Liberty,
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Steven Nekhaila
>>> >> > Region 2 Representative
>>> >> > Libertarian National Committee
>>> >> >
>>> >> > Impotentes defendere libertatum non possunt
>>> >> > "Those without power cannot defend freedom"
>>> >> >
>>> >> > References
>>> >> >
>>> >> > 1. tel:217-412-5973
>>> >>
>>> >> --
>>> >>
>>> >> --
>>> >> In Liberty,
>>> >> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>> >> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
>>> Secretary
>>> >> - [2]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>> >> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee -
>>> LPedia at LP.org
>>> >>
>>> >> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>> >> We defend your rights
>>> >> And oppose the use of force
>>> >> Taxation is theft
>>> >>
>>> >> References
>>> >>
>>> >> 1. mailto:[4][9]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> >> 2. mailto:[5]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>>
>>> --
>>>
>>> --
>>> In Liberty,
>>> Caryn Ann Harlos
>>> Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
Secretary
>>> - [6]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>> Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
>>>
>>> A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
>>> We defend your rights
>>> And oppose the use of force
>>> Taxation is theft
>>>
>>> References
>>>
>>> 1. mailto:[10]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> 2. [11]http://www.odonnell2018.org/
>>> 3. mailto:[12]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> 4. mailto:[13]lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>> 5. mailto:[14]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
>>> 6. mailto:[15]Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
--
--
In Liberty,
Caryn Ann Harlos
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
- [16]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
We defend your rights
And oppose the use of force
Taxation is theft
--
--
In Liberty,
Caryn Ann Harlos
Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
- [17]Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee - LPedia at LP.org
A haiku to the Statement of Principles:
We defend your rights
And oppose the use of force
Taxation is theft
References
1. mailto:caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
2. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
3. http://www.odonnell2018.org/
4. http://www.lpmass.org/join
5. http://www.AuditMassachusetts.com/
6. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
7. http://www.odonnell2018.org/
8. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
9. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
10. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
11. http://www.odonnell2018.org/
12. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
13. mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org
14. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
15. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
16. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
17. mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org
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