[Lnc-business] Point of Inquiry - Article 7.6

brent.olsen at lp.org brent.olsen at lp.org
Wed Mar 13 14:51:02 EDT 2019


Mr. Lyons,

I took no offense to your inquiry.  I get it.  I know that as an 
alternate I need to stay engaged in the LNC's processes at all times.  
To that end, I did attend both LNC meetings in New Orleans, I attended 
the LNC meeting in Phoenix, expressed that I would be unable to attend 
the December meeting in Alexandria when it was first arranged, and had 
planned to attend the most recent Alexandria meeting.  However, it 
turned out that I had an audit at work the week after the meeting and 
would only have been able to attend the Saturday session due to flight 
times.  On top of this, I would have arrived early in the morning on 
Saturday and would have gotten no sleep after flying all day...  So I 
decided, given that I would be a zombie on Saturday and unable to attend 
Sunday it was best for me to skip that meeting.  Flights to Austin work 
better and I won't have difficulty getting days off work I need to be 
able to be fully available.  But I have never intended to NOT be engaged 
in the LNC process during my tenure as Alternate. So I will go ahead and 
make my reservations and I look forward to seeing you in Austin.

-Brent

On 2019-03-13 11:24, Jeff Lyons wrote:
> Dr. Olsen,
> 
>      In no way, by my making this inquiry, did I intend to insist it
> be applied immediately to remove you or Mr. Anderson from this
> committee, and if that is how it was received, I apologize.  It's
> quite the opposite.  Recently, Alternate Bowden resigned citing his
> inability to participate to his own satisfaction.  I believe the
> constraints the Bylaws places on us forces us to consider these
> questions automatically, so that it doesn't come down to a "political
> football game".  Mr. Sarwark's ruling was that the rule exists and
> applies to alternates, and I hope it only serves as a notice that in
> the future, it will.  As we continue to create and populate
> subcommittees, fill other important roles and prepare our organization
> to enter the 2020 stage, we need all hands on deck!  I look forward to
> meeting you in Austin and working together on these important projects
> in the future, which I am sure will become plentiful after we hire a
> new Executive Director at the end of the month.
> 
> Stay tuned for our next non-troversy.
> 
> Very Respectfully,
> 
> Jeff Lyons
> 
> World's Worst Alternate
> 
> Get Outlook for Android [1]
> 
> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 2:02 PM -0400, "brent.olsen--- via
> Lnc-business" <lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> 
>> Thanks!  I will go ahead and make my reservations then.  I look
>> forward
>> to seeing you all in July (and some of you in April at the
>> California
>> convention).
>> 
>> -Brent
>> 
>> On 2019-03-13 09:36, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>> Brent I fear it may not be resolved until then if ever and prices
>> keep
>>> going up.  No LNC ever would have considered you resigned and
>> I’m
>>> truly sorry you are being treated like a political football.
>>> 
>>> I’m planning on acting as if this unfortunate incident never
>>> happened and hope people find better things to do with their time.
>>> 
>>> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 9:14 AM
>> wrote:
>>> 
>>>> Thank you Caryn Ann,
>>>> 
>>>> I have certainly not voluntarily resigned.  I will, however, wait
>> to
>>>> see
>>>> what the end result of this nonsense is before making my travel
>>>> reservations for Austin...
>>>> 
>>>> -Brent
>>>> 
>>>> On 2019-03-13 07:24, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business wrote:
>>>>> Here is where I am at.  I smell a game, and I don’t appreciate
>>>> being an
>>>>> unwilling participant.
>>>>> 
>>>>> I intend to conduct my business precisely as I have and the
>> Chair
>>>> can
>>>>> rule
>>>>> me out of Order.  I refuse to recognize that Brent and Phill
>> have
>>>>> resigned
>>>>> and suggest they refuse as well.
>>>>> 
>>>>> If there is a game being played here stop it.  I do not
>> sacrifice
>>>> my
>>>>> life
>>>>> and treasure for this and consider political games to be a form
>> of
>>>> 
>>>>> fraud
>>>>> and a violation of our membership pledge.
>>>>> 
>>>>> Notice I said IF there is a game.  But my instincts are
>> screaming
>>>> there
>>>>> is
>>>>> and if so count me out.  I will not play and do not consent.
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>>> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 8:03 AM Phil Anderson
>>>> 
>> 
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>> 
>>>>>> The simplest thing to do is to acknowledge that this committee
>>>>>> understands
>>>>>> the concept of 'alternate', and that each region has one
>>>>>> representative to
>>>>>> the LNC and an alternate to that representative, and let that
>>>> common
>>>>>> sense
>>>>>> and probably universal understanding guide interpretation of
>> our
>>>>>> bylaws. If
>>>>>> there are facially conflicting bylaws, let's fix those at
>>>> convention.
>>>>>> This
>>>>>> committee doesn't serve the bylaws, the bylaws serve the will
>> and
>>>> 
>>>>>> intent of
>>>>>> the party as expressed in convention, and I don't think there
>> is
>>>> a
>>>>>> dispute
>>>>>> as to what the understanding and intent of the party are...
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Get Outlook for Android
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 6:02 AM -0500, "Caryn Ann Harlos via
>>>>>> Lnc-business"
>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>> 
>>>>>> Thank you Alicia I had that in my list of nonsensical outcomes
>> as
>>>> 
>>>>>> well- and
>>>>>>> say for instance on that suspension vote for Mr. Vohra - why
>>>> were not
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> alternates told they could and should vote at that e-meeting
>>>> (even
>>>>>>> the
>>>>>>> email vote) since it is the ENTIRE LNC mentioned.  I’m
>> trying
>>>> to
>>>>>>> remember
>>>>>>> the opinion of those alternates but I’m fairly positive the
>>>> outcome
>>>>>>> would
>>>>>>> have been different.  I know region 1 would be miffed to know
>>>> this
>>>>>>> since
>>>>>>> both of my alternates were pro-suspension and Mr. Nielson
>> wished
>>>> to
>>>>>>> sponsor
>>>>>>> Mr. McKnight’s initial motion.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> In fact I’m fairly certain if alts were members Mr. Vohra
>>>> would have
>>>>>>> been
>>>>>>> soundly removed.
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> On Wed, Mar 13, 2019 at 3:11 AM Alicia Mattson via
>> Lnc-business
>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Bylaws Article 13 provides that, "The chair or secretary
>> shall
>>>> send out
>>>>>>>> electronic mail ballots on any question submitted by the
>> chair
>>>> or
>>>>>>>> cosponsored by at least 1/5 of the members of the board or
>>>> committee."
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Is it the chair's position that LNC alternates can co-sponsor
>>>> email
>>>>>>>> ballots?  And that rather than having 17 members of the LNC,
>>>> we instead
>>>>>>>> have 24 (while Region 1 is short an alternate)?  And that
>>>> quorum is 13
>>>>>>>> rather than 9?  And the 1/5-of-the-members email ballot
>>>> threshold is 5
>>>>>>>> rather than 4?  And a few other implications...
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> Some of the alternates whose statuses are not challenged
>> under
>>>> this ruling
>>>>>>>> should co-sponsor the appeal to see what happens...
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> -Alicia
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 6:16 PM Nicholas Sarwark via
>>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> I would note that I didn't discuss the policy manual at
>> all.
>>>> My
>>>>>>>>> analysis is based on the bylaws entirely.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> Specifically, Article 7.2 defines "members," and regional
>>>> alternates
>>>>>>>>> are "members" under that definition.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> The plain reading of Article 7.6 says there is an automatic
>>>> vacancy if
>>>>>>>>> a "member" misses two consecutive regular meetings.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> You may have more luck appealing the ruling if you can
>>>> explain what is
>>>>>>>>> incorrect of my reading of the bylaws.
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> -Nick
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>>> On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 4:19 PM Caryn Ann Harlos
>>>>>>>>>  wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > I would appeal that ruling of the Chair.  No policy
>> manual
>>>> change
>>>>>>>>> defined them as full members.
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Will three people please co-sponsor this?
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > On Tue, Mar 12, 2019 at 4:52 PM Nicholas Sarwark via
>>>> Lnc-business <
>>>>>>>>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> The relevant bylaws provision does appear to indicate
>>>> that they have
>>>>>>>>> >> vacated their seats automatically, though the past
>>>> practice of this
>>>>>>>>> >> board has not been to enforce that bylaws provision with
>>>> regard to
>>>>>>>>> >> Regional Alternates.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> There is at least a facially conflicting provision of
>> the
>>>> bylaws,
>>>>>>>>> >> Article 7.8, "A National Committee Regional
>>>> Representative or
>>>>>>>>> >> Alternate may be removed and replaced only by the act of
>>>> the affiliate
>>>>>>>>> >> parties that constitute the subject region. The voting
>>>> procedure for
>>>>>>>>> >> the removal and replacement of regional representatives
>>>> or alternates
>>>>>>>>> >> shall be determined by the regions. In the absence of
>> any
>>>> such
>>>>>>>>> >> procedures, a majority vote of the state chairs
>>>> comprising the region
>>>>>>>>> >> shall prevail."
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> So we have 7.6 saying there is an automatic vacancy and
>>>> 7.8 saying
>>>>>>>>> >> that removal and replacement can only be done by the
>>>> region.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> The simplest thing to do if Mr. Anderson and Dr. Olsen
>>>> are still
>>>>>>>>> >> willing and able to serve would be for their regions to
>>>> indicate that
>>>>>>>>> >> they would like to reappoint them as alternates.
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> -Nick
>>>>>>>>> >>
>>>>>>>>> >> On Mon, Mar 11, 2019 at 12:52 PM Jeff Lyons
>>>>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> > Good afternoon,
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> >       Point of Inquiry, Mr. Chairman- Have Mr.
>> Anderson
>>>> and Mr.
>>>>>>>> Olsen
>>>>>>>>> now
>>>>>>>>> >> > vacated their seats on the National Committee as a
>>>> result of being
>>>>>>>>> >> > absent from 2 consecutive regular LNC Meetings?
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> > Reference- Bylaws Article 7.6: "A National Committee
>>>> member who
>>>>>>>> fails
>>>>>>>>> to
>>>>>>>>> >> > attend two consecutive regular sessions of the
>> National
>>>> Committee
>>>>>>>>> shall
>>>>>>>>> >> > be deemed to have vacated his or her seat. The
>>>> appointing body shall
>>>>>>>>> be
>>>>>>>>> >> > free to reappoint the member who vacated the seat."
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> > --
>>>>>>>>> >> > In Liberty,
>>>>>>>>> >> > Jeff Lyons
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> > Region 8 Alternate
>>>>>>>>> >> > https://www.lp.org/wethepeople/?f=jly
>>>>>>>>> >> >
>>>>>>>>> >> > Libertarian Assoc. of MA
>>>>>>>>> >> > State Chair
>>>>>>>>> >> > http://www.lpmass.org/join
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > --
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >   In Liberty,
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
>>>> Secretary -
>>>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>>>>> > Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee -
>>>> LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>>>> > Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page
>>>> at
>>>>>>>>> facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/ [1]
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>>>>>>>> > Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism
>> *
>>>> Re-Legalize
>>>>>>>>> All Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom *
>> Repeal
>>>> All Gun
>>>>>>>> Laws *
>>>>>>>>> Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish
>>>> The Fed * End
>>>>>>>>> Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and Repeal
>>>> the Income
>>>>>>>> Tax
>>>>>>>>> * Privatize Transportation Infrastructure * Free-market
>>>> Emergency
>>>>>>>> Services
>>>>>>>>> * Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools To The
>>>> Private Sector *
>>>>>>>>> Eliminate Regulation *
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>>> > VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US or http://www.LP.org
>>>>>>>>> >
>>>>>>>> ============================================================
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> =============
>>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> *  In Liberty,*
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> *Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee
>> Secretary
>>>> *-
>>>>>>> Caryn.Ann.
>>>>>>> Harlos at LP.org  or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>>>> *Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee* - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>>>> Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page
>>>>>>> atfacebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/ [2]
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>>>>>> Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism *
>>>>>>> Re-Legalize All
>>>>>>> Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom * Repeal All
>> Gun
>>>> Laws
>>>>>>> *
>>>>>>> Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish The
>>>> Fed *
>>>>>>> End
>>>>>>> Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and Repeal
>> the
>>>>>>> Income Tax
>>>>>>> * Privatize Transportation Infrastructure * Free-market
>>>> Emergency
>>>>>>> Services
>>>>>>> * Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools To The Private
>>>> Sector
>>>>>>> *
>>>>>>> Eliminate Regulation *
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> *VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US or http://www.LP.org *
>>>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>>>>>> 
>>>>>>> --
>>>>> 
>>>>> *  In Liberty,*
>>>>> 
>>>>> *Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary
>> *-
>>>> 
>>>>> Caryn.Ann.
>>>>> Harlos at LP.org  or Secretary at LP.org.
>>>>> *Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee* - LPedia at LP.org
>>>>> Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page at
>>>>> facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/ [1]
>>>>> 
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>>>> Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism *
>>>> Re-Legalize
>>>>> All
>>>>> Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom * Repeal All Gun
>>>> Laws *
>>>>> Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish The
>> Fed
>>>> * End
>>>>> Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and Repeal the
>>>> Income
>>>>> Tax
>>>>> * Privatize Transportation Infrastructure * Free-market
>> Emergency
>>>>> Services
>>>>> * Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools To The Private
>>>> Sector *
>>>>> Eliminate Regulation *
>>>>> 
>>>>> *VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US or http://www.LP.org
>>>>> *
>>>>> 
>>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>> --
>>> 
>>> IN LIBERTY,
>>> __
>>> 
>>> LIBERTARIAN PARTY AND LIBERTARIAN NATIONAL COMMITTEE SECRETARY -
>>> Caryn.Ann. Harlos at LP.org or Secretary at LP.org.
>>> CHAIR, LP HISTORICAL PRESERVATION COMMITTEE - LPedia at LP.org
>>> 
>>> Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page at
>>> facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/ [1]
>>> 
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>> Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism *
>> Re-Legalize
>>> All Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom * Repeal All
>> Gun
>>> Laws * Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish
>> The
>>> Fed * End Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and
>> Repeal
>>> the Income Tax * Privatize Transportation Infrastructure *
>> Free-market
>>> Emergency Services * Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools
>> To
>>> The Private Sector * Eliminate Regulation *
>>> 
>>> VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US OR HTTP://WWW.LP.ORG [3]
>>> 
>> 
> =========================================================================
>>> 
>>> 
>>> Links:
>>> ------
>>> [1] http://facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/
>>> [2] http://atfacebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/
>>> [3] http://www.lp.org/
> 
> 
> Links:
> ------
> [1] https://aka.ms/ghei36




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