[Lnc-business] Motion to censure Benjamin Leder

[Richard Longstreth]

Greetings again,

The state chairs of region 1 came together quickly and agreed that an
abstain vote is the will of the region and so I change my vote to abstain
with all of the same points I made previously.
...
We do not wish there to be any perception that we approve of Mr Leder's
comments and a no vote could be perceived that way whereas we hope to send
the message, by our abstention, that this should not be an LNC matter.

Richard

On Mon, Jul 15, 2019, 19:11 Richard Longstreth <richard.longstreth at lp.org>
wrote:

> In my capacity as Region 1 Representative, I vote nay.
>
> There are a couple of nuances to talk about in relation to the vote. My
> role is to represent the region. I am trusted to hear their voices and
> concerns and use my judgement to make decisions. For this decision, I
> sought feedback from the state chairs via messenger, from the region on the
> region 1 discussion group, and from people in general via the lnc business
> – discuss group. There were many thoughts and opinions brought up but
> ultimately, I had to consider the following:
>
>    1.
>
>    Who is Benjamin Leder? He is a member of the Libertarian Party who is
>    running for president, albeit, polling poorly in most circles. There is
>    evidence of colorful language and advocation of violence and threats to a
>    variety of people attributed to him. However, this is a vote to censure,
>    not a vote to report him to the proper authorities to prevent acts of
>    potential domestic terrorism. If any person, whether on the LNC or
>    otherwise feels threatened in anyway by any person, you have somewhat of a
>    moral obligation to let the authorities know. I am a proud Radical Caucus
>    member, but this is where philosophy meets reality. I, nor does the LNC,
>    have any ability to stop any violence advocated by Mr. Leder and a censure
>    would not stop any violent plans. It pains me to say that this is exactly
>    the type of thing a government, in the current era of politics, can help
>    prevent. If there was a working private police network or other security
>    organization that could actively prevent the violence advocated by Mr.
>    Leder, then I would be in favor of reporting to them instead. Safety is
>    priority and at the end of the day, everyone ought to feel safe and secure
>    at home or going to a political convention. Again, I urge any party
>    that feels threatened to report to authorities why you feel threatened.
>    A censure will not alleviate those threats in anyway.
>    2.
>
>    What does censure mean and or accomplish? Essentially a censure is
>    when a body sends the message that they disapprove of a person’s statements
>    or actions in a formal way. It is not a true disciplinary action, nor does
>    it have any real effects, other than a record of condemnation. If the LNC
>    censures someone, we are formally stating that we do not approve of that
>    person. If we do that as the LNC, we are stating, essentially, that we wish
>    for that individual not be a member. Part of being a member is to agree to
>    the non-aggression principle.
>    3.
>       1.
>
>       Mr. Leder clearly has made several statements which indicate he no
>       longer agrees with the non-aggression principle and so, in my mind, he has
>       already resigned as a member and a censure would accomplish little and
>       would likely have no effect on him.
>       2.
>
>       There is however, the chance the censuring him would have a reverse
>       effect: he becomes a martyr to like-minded individuals and a beacon for
>       those who agree or sympathize with him. It also could push him to a point
>       of no longer caring. Right now, his comments have no verifiable evidence of
>       action that I can find. If Mr. Leder believes himself to be a member and
>       then the leadership turns their back on him by censuring, where does that
>       leave him? An unstable mind that feels abandoned is a dangerous thing.
>       4.
>
>    Should this body (the LNC) even consider censure?
>    5.
>       1.
>
>       In recent history, there have been two censures brought before the
>       LNC – one of Arvin Vohra, a member of the LNC at the time the LNC was
>       considering and the other is Benjamin Leder, LP member and declared,
>       FEC-filing presidential candidate. Essentially, the situation with Mr.
>       Vohra was brought to the LNC because Mr. Vohra was part of the LNC.
>       Censuring him separated his viewpoints from those of his colleagues and as
>       leaders of the party it was worth discussing and voting on. In Mr. Leder’s
>       case, however, he is not on the LNC. Further, he is not a state chair nor,
>       to my knowledge, involved in any state’s leadership. He is simply a member
>       who is saying inappropriate things. I do not believe the LNC should have a
>       role in reviewing each member of the party to determine if they have ever
>       said or done anything deserving of censure. It sets a bad precedent. I
>       understood the LNC discussing Mr. Vohra, who sat next to them as a leader
>       of this party. I do not understand reaching down into common membership to
>       do the same.
>       2.
>
>       Since I have already explained what a censure is, then I will also
>       say that a censure could also be construed as voicing an opinion on the
>       upcoming election and candidates quite easily. The LNC traditionally has
>       kept its distance from such conversations of endorsing or condemning
>       presidential candidates until after convention in favor of letting
>       delegates decide for themselves.
>       6.
>
>    Mr. Leder is running for president; doesn’t that give him a different
>    spotlight? No. To date, there are currently 779 candidates running for
>    president. Of those, 34 are Libertarian. If Mr Leder running for president
>    means something, then I challenge any Libertarian to name all 34 candidates
>    running for our party without looking it up. To be honest, I only knew of
>    about 10. He is a member who filed some paperwork. That does not elevate
>    his status, especially this far out from Convention and the 2020 election.
>    If he were our presidential nominee, then I would absolutely favor censure.
>    7.
>
>    This could start a witch hunt mentality and could lead to a slippery
>    slope. Often I hear people joke about purity tests in the Party. I refuse
>    to let the LNC become a potential tool for such activity. I am fearful of a
>    day when something I say in emotion or out of context could be construed to
>    mean something other than intended. In this case, Mr. Leder probably should
>    be reprimanded, and he has been. The LPRC accepted his forced resignation
>    and the leadership in Texas is discussing him because he is one of their
>    members. If the LNC begins commenting on who is libertarian enough or
>    libertarian appropriate, we begin to establish what the bar for being a
>    libertarian is which should never be a purpose of our leadership. The
>    purpose of the LNC is to develop and guide the future of the party, not get
>    bogged down determining if someone is living up to their pledge or not.
>    8.
>
>    What if he goes off the deep end (McVeigh style) and the LNC didn’t
>    censure? That would be a terrible scenario, however, I would argue that the
>    opposite could happen as well. I believe Mr. Leder to be a sick, possibly
>    violent, social media warrior. Whether the LNC censures or not is
>    irrelevant to the media and outsiders if he has Libertarian next to his
>    name; even if it is only self-proclaimed media would latch onto the word.
>    Further, because he has filed as a Libertarian to run for president, there
>    is nothing the LNC can do to shake our name from his by voting on it via
>    email in 7 days. The other points I’ve made are based in principle and
>    thought, not an emotional appeal to the what ifs of the world. If something
>    terrible were to happen, I am in favor of writing and introducing a
>    resolution condemning his actions and explaining why violence does not jive
>    with libertarian ideals. One should not condemn a man for his words on
>    social media, but for his actions in the real world.
>
>
> ...
> On Fri, Jul 12, 2019, 13:45 Erin Adams via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> Our region will cast a vote before the deadline
>> On Jul 12, 2019 12:00 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
>> wrote:
>>
>> Is that a yes?
>>
>> On Fri, Jul 12, 2019 at 10:30 AM Erin Adams via Lnc-business <
>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>
>> Oklahoma voted to censure Joe Exotic in 2017. In 2018 Oklahoma voted to
>> remove the membership of Joe Exotic just before he was convicted on over 20
>> federal charges INCLUDING multiple counts of murder for hire. The members
>> saw "smoke" and acted . The members were correct imo. Joe Exotic is STILL a
>> declared candidate for our POTUS nomination....
>>
>> I fully support this motion
>>
>> Erin Adams
>> Region 7 Alternate
>>
>> On Jul 10, 2019 6:53 PM, Joshua Smith via Lnc-business <
>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>>
>> Good evening esteemed colleagues,
>>
>> I am currently looking for co-sponsors for my motion to censure Benjamin
>> Leder. He is a candidate for our POTUS Nomination and has been spreading
>> some pretty hanus stuff. I believe that as party leadership it is extremely
>> important that we let the party know that we arent supportive of these
>> actions.
>>
>> Motion below:
>>
>> To the Libertarian National Committee
>>
>> WHEREAS, Mr. Benjamin Leder (Texas) is currently running to be elected as
>> the Libertarian Party's nominee for President of the United States;
>>
>> WHEREAS, Mr. Leder has continually engaged in behavior that goes directly
>> against our core principles and is antithetical to the mission of any
>> representative of the Libertarian Party;
>>
>> WHEREAS, He has made direct violent threats and approval of domestic
>> terrorism against the Libertarian Party, including its National Committee
>> members, conventions, candidates, and members of local affiliates, in cases
>> not in self-defense, but in blatant aggression to achieve political goals;
>>
>> WHEREAS, As examples of the above, he has published articles, appeared in
>> media, and  posted on social media clear threats of violence and advocate
>> of domestic terrorism on peaceful people,  including calling for an
>> "Oklahoma City style" ending to not only the Democratic and Republican
>> conventions, but also of the 2020 Libertarian National Convention, thus
>> putting in danger our staff, delegates, and family members;
>>
>> WHEREAS, He has made public, violent statements about killing peaceful
>> people and "leaving their bodies in contractor bags at the curb for the
>> garbage man";
>>
>> WHEREAS, He has called for members who support the official Libertarian
>> Party position of being anti-war to be physically battered;
>>
>> WHEREAS, the Libertarian Party absolutely repudiates non-defensive
>> violence and all aggression against peaceful people, and associating such
>> statements with our Party defames its members and brand; and
>>
>> RESOLVED, That the Libertarian National Committee condemns these actions
>> by Mr. Leder as completely abhorrent to the mission, platform, and
>> principles of the Libertarian Party.
>>
>> Respectfully submitted,
>>
>> Joshua D. Smith, LNC At Large Representative
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>>
>> *In Liberty,*
>>
>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperberger's Syndrome
>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can effect inter-personal
>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know.  I am asking you to help
>> me - in a diverse world, we must work to meet each other halfway.*
>>
>>
>>
>>