[Lnc-business] Fwd: LNC 2020 Convention Solution Input

Sat May 9 10:49:54 EDT 2020

This is exactly what was referred to in Mr.  Smith's email.

*In Liberty,*

* Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
(part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *

On Sat, May 9, 2020 at 8:29 AM <dustin.nanna at lp.org> wrote:

> The proposal put forth by Avens is EXACTLY what I'd like to see happen in
> my perfect utopia. The delegates will have control of the agenda once we
> gavel in but I trust them to make good decisions. We could even recommend
> (not demand) as the LNC in any motion we make, that the delegates rearrange
> the agenda for expediency.
>
> On May 9, 2020 2:31 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
> I can never set aside bylaws.  Ever.  The government does that.  Not
> Libertarians.  Libertarians honor contracts.
>
> Plus I have just been informed of certain sworn statements I will be
> required to submit to states about our nomination.
>
> I dare anyone to humbly suggest I need to commit perjury for expediency.
> I
> have some choice words for anyone who does.  You are asking me to risk my
> career.  And before the snark comes in, I was elected to the position and
> I
> won’t resign so someone else can commit perjury.
>
> I ask staff to provide me copies of the forms that had to be signed last
> cycle.  I want to see what I have to swear to.
>
> Humility has nothing to do with member rights.
>
> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 11:24 PM Phillip Anderson <phillip.anderson at lp.org>
>
> wrote:
>
> > Madame Secretary, I’m well aware of who has been discussing what. The
> > humility I’d like to see is members of this committee setting aside
> > commitments to positions already taken in order to move forward with
> > business entrusted to it.
> >
> > On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 10:16 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> Mr. Anderson this is exactly what a majority of LNC members have
> already
> >> been discussing, and it has nothing to do with humility but with
> honouring
> >> our bylaws.
> >>
> >> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 9:02 PM Phillip Anderson via Lnc-business <
> >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> This is excellent, well thought out. Now let’s see who is humble
> enough
> >>> to
> >>> lead.
> >>>
> >>> On Fri, May 8, 2020 at 9:14 PM john.phillips--- via Lnc-business <
> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > Forward of an email with detailed convention thoughts from Avens
> >>> Obrien.
> >>> >
> >>> > Lots of interesting thoughts for consideration.
> >>> >
> >>> > John Phillips
> >>> > Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> > Cell 217-412-5973
> >>> > ---------- Forwarded message ----------
> >>> > From: Avens O'Brien <avens.obrien at gmail.com>
> >>> > Date: May 8, 2020 8:59 PM
> >>> > Subject: LNC 2020 Convention Solution Input
> >>> > To: john.phillips at lp.org
> >>> > Cc:
> >>> >
> >>> > Hi John -
> >>> >
> >>> > Per your suggestion on Facebook, I am submitting this in an email
> for
> >>> you
> >>> > to forward on to the rest of the LNC.
> >>> >
> >>> > I posted this on Facebook earlier today and it has received
> >>> > positive feedback. The original link can be found here:
> >>> > https://www.facebook.com/avobrien/posts/10100329054914256
> >>> >
> >>> > I apologize for the length, I am reviewing the problems around the
> >>> > convention, the downsides of proposed solutions, and finally a
> >>> breakdown of
> >>> > the actual processes involved in my proposed solution.
> >>> >
> >>> > I am aware that others have suggested things like what I am
> suggesting.
> >>> > I have dived a bit deeper into the details, I believe.
> >>> >
> >>> > As a long-time member, delegate of several years and volunteer, I
> >>> would be
> >>> > happy to assist the convention committee or anyone in implementing
> >>> these
> >>> > ideas or related but alternative solutions.
> >>> >
> >>> > The content of my original post is below.
> >>> >
> >>> > Best,
> >>> > Avens O'Brien
> >>> > Former Vice Chair, LPNH 2006-2008
> >>> > CA Delegate to National, 2020
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > PROBLEM:
> >>> >
> >>> > The Libertarian Party was supposed to have an in-person convention
> over
> >>> > Memorial Day Weekend (starting May 21st) in Austin TX. We are unable
> >>> to do
> >>> > that, due to restrictions by the city of Austin or state of TX in
> the
> >>> face
> >>> > of Covid-19.
> >>> >
> >>> > This convention is where we select our Presidential and Vice
> >>> Presidential
> >>> > candidates, where we select new LNC officers/reps, and
> deliberate/vote
> >>> on
> >>> > changes to our bylaws, platform, and more. It is also a substantial
> >>> > fundraiser.
> >>> >
> >>> > We also have a really great time partying and seeing each other in
> >>> person
> >>> > since we spend so much time bickering online and it’s really nice to
> >>> get
> >>> > the real life experience of each other. I have come away from each
> >>> national
> >>> > convention liking my fellow Libertarians so much more than I often
> do
> >>> > arguing online.
> >>> >
> >>> > So, unfortunately, we will have no in-person convention during
> Memorial
> >>> > Day weekend.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > ALTERNATIVE #1
> >>> >
> >>> > One alternative solution is to move the date of the in-person
> >>> convention.
> >>> > We do not yet know how long travel or gathering restrictions are
> going
> >>> to
> >>> > last, and even when they have been lifted, we don’t yet know how
> many
> >>> > delegates would not be able to attend due to health concerns
> >>> (themselves or
> >>> > those they live with) and also adjusting for new travel location and
> >>> time.
> >>> >
> >>> > Besides the possibility that attendance will be lowered, this
> creates
> >>> an
> >>> > issue of perhaps a poor representation of the delegates if, say, all
> >>> older
> >>> > delegates do not attend due to health concerns.
> >>> >
> >>> > This also creates issues with ballot access for some states (which
> is
> >>> also
> >>> > being worked on) and even more: campaign time. Waiting until July or
> >>> August
> >>> > to nominate minimizes the amount of time our nominee has to
> >>> campaign/take
> >>> > donations/try to get media attention towards themselves and the
> Party.
> >>> >
> >>> > I will attend any in-person convention that occurs, because I have
> low
> >>> > person risk of major Covid-19 complications, the ability to
> quarantine
> >>> > myself, and an annoying sense of duty to ensure my voice as a
> delegate
> >>> is
> >>> > represented no matter what.
> >>> >
> >>> > I realize others cannot make that same choice.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > ALTERNATIVE #2
> >>> >
> >>> > A second alternative solution is to have an all-online convention
> using
> >>> > video meeting software like Zoom. This would allow delegates (and
> >>> > alternates) to log in from their computers at home and participate
> in
> >>> floor
> >>> > discuss, debates, votes etc. This would allow people to participate
> >>> > wherever they are without travel restrictions or health concerns.
> >>> >
> >>> > This also has issues: 1000 people logging in to participate,
> proposed
> >>> > resolutions, debate, discussion, votes? In the in-person convention
> >>> hall it
> >>> > has its own faults, but there’s also controls: limited microphones,
> a
> >>> stage
> >>> > from which the meeting is run, and the self-restraint that is
> >>> (somewhat)
> >>> > created by the fact that individuals attending actually had to pay
> to
> >>> get
> >>> > there, and aren’t going to do things that would get them thrown out.
> >>> We DO
> >>> > behave ourselves better in person than we do online.
> >>> >
> >>> > There may or may not also be issues if there’s an online-convention
> >>> with
> >>> > states (or state parties) recognizing the delegate vote on the
> >>> presidential
> >>> > and vice presidential nominees.
> >>> >
> >>> > Also, let’s be honest: the national convention IN PERSON is a HUGE
> >>> > fundraising opportunity for the party. There are NUMEROUS avenues,
> from
> >>> > gala dinners to pie-throwing afterparties, where we make money, and
> an
> >>> > online convention DOES make that harder.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > PROBLEMS VS SOLUTIONS
> >>> >
> >>> > Along the way, observing this, I have been disappointed in the
> amount
> >>> of
> >>> > “problem seeking” behavior rather than “solution seeking” behavior
> of
> >>> some
> >>> > people inside the party and on the LNC.
> >>> >
> >>> > Many of the people who are adamantly opposed to online convention
> will
> >>> > disrupt one. Many of the people who are adamantly opposed to an
> >>> in-person
> >>> > convention will emphasize the risks, the ballot-concerns. These ARE
> >>> valid:
> >>> > online conventions can be disrupted in ways IRL (in real life) ones
> >>> can’t.
> >>> > There may be ballot issues, health risks, and representation
> problems.
> >>> >
> >>> > Ultimately, it appears that many people may refuse to acknowledge
> the
> >>> > result of a vote cast in either situation, claiming it’s not
> >>> > representative, or within order, or whatever.
> >>> >
> >>> > No matter what way we decide: we will have huge numbers of this
> >>> convention
> >>> > feeling disenfranchised, poorly represented, or potentially ignored,
> >>> and
> >>> > this may affect support for our candidates.
> >>> >
> >>> > What can be done about that?
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > A BETTER SOLUTION
> >>> >
> >>> > I can’t honestly see that either an exclusively online or
> exclusively
> >>> > in-person option will work.
> >>> >
> >>> > As someone who has attended years and years of National and State
> >>> > conventions, here is my preferred solution – one that utilizes
> online
> >>> > voting and possibly in-person confirmations.
> >>> >
> >>> > We have an online vote among delegates for our President/Vice
> President
> >>> > candidates, and then potentially move the in-person convention to
> >>> later in
> >>> > the year.
> >>> >
> >>> > BUT BASIC POLLING ISN’T ENOUGH. There are things we need to be able
> to
> >>> do
> >>> > that basic polling does not allow.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > ONLINE VOTE PROCESS:
> >>> >
> >>> > First – state delegate chairs or state party chairs need to ensure
> they
> >>> > have the best contact information for their delegates – both email
> and
> >>> > phone. We need to confirm methods of communication, and we ALSO need
> >>> to be
> >>> > VERY communicative about timelines.
> >>> >
> >>> > We should make our decisions about when these things will be
> happening
> >>> and
> >>> > then giving, say, a week notice so that people can make sure they’re
> >>> > looking out.
> >>> >
> >>> > SO, I’m going to suggest timelines here, which are not binding, they
> >>> are
> >>> > examples:
> >>> >
> >>> > We tell delegates this weekend, that P/VP nomination process will be
> >>> > occurring beginning on May 21st, and a calendar for the next dates
> is
> >>> then
> >>> > created based on this start date. This calendar of the timeline
> should
> >>> be
> >>> > PUBLIC, posted on the LNC website and emailed to delegates,
> alternates
> >>> AND
> >>> > even party members (who have an interest in observing).
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > TOKENS
> >>> >
> >>> > So, normally at a National Convention, the delegates receive tokens,
> >>> which
> >>> > they can use NOT for their vote for President and VP, but to
> determine
> >>> who
> >>> > they want in the official LNC debate. This narrows the field for the
> >>> debate.
> >>> >
> >>> > We need to emulate this process. Delegates (only) should have the
> >>> ability
> >>> > to give their tokens via a vote distributed via email. Perhaps the
> >>> link to
> >>> > the vote is sent to the email on file, but the password to login is
> >>> called
> >>> > or texted, reducing chances of hacking or others using their code.
> >>> There
> >>> > are multiple ways to validate votes.
> >>> >
> >>> > Let’s say this is emailed out on May 21st. Delegates will have 24
> >>> hours to
> >>> > respond – I highly recommend someone from each state is determined
> by
> >>> each
> >>> > state party to call/email/remind delegates to do this. I would agree
> >>> to do
> >>> > this for CA if needed.
> >>> >
> >>> > The LNC collects the results of the token vote. This determines
> (based
> >>> on
> >>> > number of tokens received) who is in the main debate. There is a
> >>> minimum
> >>> > number required from the conventions that I can’t remember right now
> >>> (30?).
> >>> > This would be the same.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > DEBATE
> >>> >
> >>> > The LNC hosts a live Zoom debate (say on the 23rd) using a moderator
> >>> who
> >>> > was going to be chosen for the in-person debate anyway. The only
> >>> > participants will be the debate moderator and the candidates who
> >>> qualified.
> >>> > This will be recorded, for distribution to the delegates.
> >>> >
> >>> > SPEECHES
> >>> >
> >>> > At each convention, we allow the candidates (I believe anyone who
> was
> >>> > nominated and then seconded?) to address the convention in a limited
> >>> speech
> >>> > (5 mins?) in which they can speak themselves, or have others speak
> on
> >>> their
> >>> > behalf.
> >>> >
> >>> > Candidates would be given the right to prepare a video of the same
> >>> length
> >>> > as the usual speech, which could potentially feature other people
> who
> >>> speak
> >>> > on their behalf, or might be a well-produced campaign video.
> Whatever
> >>> they
> >>> > want, within the time limitations. These videos will be hosted on
> >>> various
> >>> > video platforms, and collected by the LNC.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > VOTE #1
> >>> >
> >>> > The LNC, on May 24th, would then send out an email to all members,
> >>> with a
> >>> > link to the debate, as well as a link to each candidate video. Also,
> >>> to the
> >>> > delegates: a link to the first Presidential vote. (Again, perhaps
> >>> requiring
> >>> > a password that was sent separately, again to better validate the
> >>> votes).
> >>> >
> >>> > The delegates would have 48 hours (or perhaps 24 hours) to vote
> (this
> >>> > allows for what usually happens during an in person convention –
> >>> internal
> >>> > caucus and campaign lobbying can occur via phone calls and emails).
> >>> This
> >>> > puts us at the 26th if we’re doing 48 hour votes.
> >>> >
> >>> > The results of this vote would be emailed to the delegates/members
> (and
> >>> > shared on social media) and then if another round is required, we do
> >>> the
> >>> > same thing we would do at the in-person convention, with a slightly
> >>> > different timeline: candidates have say, 12 hours to send new
> >>> time-limited
> >>> > videos dropping out/endorsing anyone, before another round of
> voting.
> >>> >
> >>> > This continues in the same fashion until we have determined our
> >>> nominee by
> >>> > over 50% of the delegate vote. The same process occurs for the VP
> spot.
> >>> >
> >>> > This should land us into the very beginning of June with our
> results.
> >>> >
> >>> > ________________________________
> >>> >
> >>> > POTENTIAL IN-PERSON CONVENTION
> >>> >
> >>> > Once the Presidential and Vice Presidential candidates are chosen,
> we
> >>> can
> >>> > begin petition collecting or ballot efforts or campaigning and
> >>> volunteers
> >>> > and whatever the heck we need to begin doing to support them.
> >>> >
> >>> > We plan for an in-person convention in, say, August or even
> September.
> >>> > This allows us to do platform, bylaws, officer elections. We can
> also
> >>> > certify the vote made in late May/early June regarding our P/VP
> >>> nominees.
> >>> >
> >>> > This in-person convention can also have the Presidential and Vice
> >>> > Presidential nominees as the keynotes, and operate much like other
> >>> > conventions: celebrating an already determined nominee, and
> generating
> >>> > press and interest for that. As well as fundraising.
> >>> >
> >>> > THE BIG IF:
> >>> >
> >>> > IF as we get into June, we find that an in-person convention is less
> >>> > likely even as far out as July or August or September, we still have
> a
> >>> much
> >>> > longer timeline for determining what changes we need to make when:
> >>> perhaps
> >>> > officer elections also become an online process like P/VP.
> >>> >
> >>> > Perhaps a motion is made to reserve bylaw and platform changes to
> the
> >>> 2022
> >>> > convention in order to acknowledge this unprecedented event
> globally,
> >>> and
> >>> > then we do some sort of online state chair convention to ratify the
> >>> P/VP
> >>> > election. I’m not sure, but the fact is we can spend months figuring
> >>> out
> >>> > the right solution for THAT. We just can’t spend months waiting on
> our
> >>> > Presidential/VP ticket.
> >>> >
> >>> > Please feel free to contact me for further clarification, questions,
> or
> >>> > help.
> >>> >
> >>> > I look forward to learning what the LNC decides.
> >>> >
> >>> > Best,
> >>> > Avens O'Brien
> >>> > CA Delegate 2020
> >>> > Former LPNH Vice Chair, 2006-2008
> >>> > 818.308.5098 | avens.obrien at gmail.com
> >>> >
> >>> > ...
> >>> >
> >>> > Avens O'Brien
> >>> > http://www.avens.me
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>> >
> >>>
> >> --
> >>
> >> *In Liberty,*
> >>
> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> faux
> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>
> >> --
>
> *In Liberty,*
>
> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
>
>
>