[Lnc-business] Fwd: [Lnc-votes] Resignation From LPF

David Demarest dprattdemarest at gmail.com
Fri Oct 27 14:23:43 EDT 2017 

I agree that there are limits to what the LNC can do in this matter. What
the LNC can do is inspire and empower individual Libertarians to be fully
informed with a full set of principles and accurate facts so they
individually use voluntary economic and social ostracism in an appropriate,
just and effective manner to deal with thinly-disguised authoritarian
threats exemplified by the nonsense in Florida.

Physical threats are a serious matter that cuts to the core of what
Libertarianism stands for. Political correctness and ridicule of those who
take a stand against bigotry is not a principled answer.

Regardless, threats or no threats, memes or no memes, I will speak out at
every opportunity against mindless bigotry that goes hand-in-hand with
authoritarianism and nationalism, as I am doing now. We all have a choice
on how we deal with ethno-nationalism. I hope for the sake of the LP and
the Libertarian movement that we individual Libertarians choose wisely.

Thoughts?

~David Pratt Demarest

On Oct 27, 2017 12:52 PM, "Caryn Ann Harlos" <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
wrote:

> Larry I don't disagree with you.  That has been my position.  And unless
> we want to disaffiliate it's like pulling a gun.  Don't do that unless you
> intend to shoot.
>
> I just wanted to be clear that I've been reading material, also comparing
> it with my past experiences, and then that "response" by Ramsey and I'm not
> buying that there isn't a problem.  What gets done must be spearheaded by
> Florida Libertarians.
>
> I'm not fooled IOW.  And honestly I came to the realization of how toxic
> this may be, particularly to women in the Party, who would leave silently.
> I asked myself if I would stick around that.  The answer is not an
> unequivocal yes.
>
> I stand by my comments that there is a bullying and threatening issue with
> the far left as well.  There was a threat to bring ANTIFA to our
> convention.  There is condemnation of the idea of property ownership and we
> don't have to look too far into history to see where that leads.  And
> violence has been discussed.  I see it too.  And believe we have a shameful
> reluctance to call that what it is.  It's not a matter of equivalency or
> comparing thresholds of damage.  It's about defending libertarian ideas.
>
>
> The fact is that these two sides feed on each other.  The existence of one
> gives the other propaganda.
>
> We must continue to keep on the northward libertarian route.
>
> But make no mistake- there IS an ethno-nationalist issue in Florida.
>
> Read Ramsey's response.  If you do not see manipulative gas lighting then
> you lack discernment.
>
> If all we can do is personally say to those complaining- yes I see what
> you are saying.  You are not imagining things- that is valuable.
>
> We are a limited power body.  We can resist the urge to think we can or
> should intervene in everything.  But that does not mean not seeing the
> thing.  I see it.
>
> -Caryn Ann
>
>
> On Fri, Oct 27, 2017 at 11:32 AM Daniel Hayes <danielehayes at icloud.com>
> wrote:
>
>> Sagely spoken once again my friend.
>>
>>
>> Daniel
>>
>> Sent from my iPhone
>>
>> On Oct 27, 2017, at 12:28 PM, Larry Sharpe <lsharpe at neo-sage.com> wrote:
>>
>> My two cents,
>>
>> Ed and Steven both say leave it alone. So, leave it alone.
>>
>> They may be wrong, but the odds of them being wrong are far lower than
>> the odds of our meddling making things worse.
>>
>> On Oct 27, 2017 12:22, "David Demarest" <dprattdemarest at gmail.com> wrote:
>>
>>> I agree with Caryn Ann, there sure is a lot of smoke in Florida. It is
>>> time to stop pooh-poohing this thinly-disguised bigotry, ethno-nationalism
>>> and power-grab threat to both Florida and national Libertarianism; stop
>>> sweeping it under the rug and take a serious look at the matter.
>>>
>>> Disagreements on the application of the NAP, while a serious matter, are
>>> understandable. Disagreements on mindless bigotry and ethno-nationalism,
>>> however, will be a malignant cancer on the LP and Libertarian movement if
>>> not addressed promptly and assertively.
>>>
>>> I reiterate, not tolerating intolerance is NOT bigotry. Tolerance in
>>> defense of intolerance is a VICE. This should be a no-brainer to all
>>> Libertarians. Bigots and ethno-nationalist power-grabbers must not be part
>>> of our target market. They will only use us to achieve their nefarious
>>> goals that will undermine our credibility. Like Wes and Nick, I ask
>>> pseudo-Libertarians who think otherwise to promptly take their political
>>> business elsewhere.
>>>
>>> We can follow the lead of Nick and Wes and use the tool of voluntary
>>> individual economic and social ostracism to bring this insidious threat to
>>> a screeching halt. Disaffiliation, while a last resort, can be an effective
>>> institutional tool of economic and social ostracism, fully consistent with
>>> even a strict interpretation of the NAP, to effectively deal with this
>>> potentially lethal threat to Libertarianism.
>>>
>>> It is time to clean this mindless evil out of the LP and Libertarian
>>> movement before it gets out of control, impacts our political agenda and
>>> undermines our heroic goal of freedom, nothing more, nothing less.
>>>
>>> Thoughts?
>>>
>>> ~David Pratt Demarest
>>>
>>> On Oct 27, 2017 9:29 AM, "Caryn Ann Harlos" <carynannharlos at gmail.com>
>>> wrote:
>>>
>>>>
>>>> I just read a "response" by Ryan Ramsey and it has all the marks of an
>>>> aggressive gas lighting campaign.  After I read that letter, my "knower"
>>>> knew that there are too many testimonies that ring true.  There is a very
>>>> manipulative game going on.
>>>>
>>>> There is definitely something very toxic going on in Florida.  I am
>>>> going to be speaking to my Region 1 Chairs about this as I make my
>>>> quarterly conferences with them.
>>>>
>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>>
>>>> On Thu, Oct 26, 2017 at 6:52 AM Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net>
>>>> wrote:
>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> If there is clear evidence of (1) a current Florida LP state-level
>>>>> official making clearly racist statements, or clear and credible threats of
>>>>> violence, and (2) the Florida LP leadership being aware of this and taking
>>>>> no action whatsoever to condemn it or distance the Florida LP from it, I
>>>>> think perhaps a letter of concern from the LNC would be in order. If the
>>>>> Florida LP leadership offered no reasonable response to such a letter and
>>>>> continued to not take any remedial action, especially if it became clear
>>>>> that this was part of a pattern of ignoring racism or serious
>>>>> Non-Aggression Principle violations from state leaders, then I would be
>>>>> ready to entertain a motion to disaffiliate.
>>>>>
>>>>> But – and I confess I have not read all the links and background on
>>>>> this – I'm not sure even the first condition stated above has been met. My
>>>>> personal belief is that Ryan Ramsey likely does hold bigoted white
>>>>> supremacist type views, but while the the evidence for this may be
>>>>> cumulatively compelling (walks like a duck, quacks like a duck, etc.), it
>>>>> also seems to be largely circumstantial. I looked at the American Guard
>>>>> website for instance, and didn't find a "smoking gun" of explicitly racist
>>>>> material. Now I do think Ramsey's comments about LP chair Nick Sarwark are
>>>>> reprehensible and without merit. A sample (more at
>>>>> http://archive.is/EMZPY#selection-233.0-233.110):
>>>>>
>>>>> *"*Nick Sarwark, National Chairman of the Libertarian Party, is the
>>>>> poster boy for the Cultural Marxist idiocy that keeps us relegated to
>>>>> single digit election returns... *Any question as to whether Mr.
>>>>> Sarwark was a lover of liberty, or a Cultural Marxist attempting to hold
>>>>> back the advance of the  Libertarian Party, were answered when he made
>>>>> national news repeating lies about Milo Yiannopoulos, subject of the
>>>>> violence in Berkley, when he insinuated bloodshed to stop free speech was
>>>>> 'understandable'... **For those who did not attend the National
>>>>> Convention last spring in Orlando, let me tell you how Nick Sarwark was
>>>>> re-elected as LP Chairman. He collected a group of loyalists around himself
>>>>> to feign running as opposition. Then at the last minute, on the Convention
>>>>> floor, they dropped their candidacy and threw their support to the man
>>>>> trying to do the Weimar Republic over, as if the Communists will win this
>>>>> time. This is why many are starting to  refer to him as 'Nazi Nick',
>>>>> despite his Jewish religion. His ignorance of history is astounding,
>>>>> especially considering his heritage. It is an ignorance common among the
>>>>> products of compulsory government education camps, but unacceptable for
>>>>> anyone wishing to lead the third largest political party in the greatest
>>>>> nation on the planet. The smug manner in which the leftist infection tries
>>>>> to paint President Trump as Hitler is the crowning jewel of their
>>>>> ignorance. It is time for a quick history lesson on Germany prior to World
>>>>> War Two. Trump is not Hitler, but people like Sarwark are ushering the next
>>>>> Hitler in... Behold Nick Sarwark, who claims to lead the party of
>>>>> individual freedom, as he ushers his own Jewish people toward the boxcars.
>>>>> Nazi Nick, the ultimate in self hatred."*
>>>>>
>>>>> Even if the rumor about Milo Yiannopoulis planning to "out"
>>>>> undocumented students during his speech at UC Berkeley, which Yiannopoulis
>>>>> ultimately did not do and denied intending to do, was false – I'm not sure
>>>>> it was; I wouldn't be surprised if Yiannopoulis, via associates, was the
>>>>> source of the rumor, even if he never intended to carry out any such action
>>>>> – the point is that if student protesters heard the rumor and sincerely
>>>>> believed it, there's an argument to be made that their use of violence to
>>>>> stop him from speaking arguably was, to the best of their knowledge at the
>>>>> time, a legitimate defensive measure designed to prevent people being
>>>>> forcibly kidnapped and deported by the State. I'm not sure Nick intended to
>>>>> go that far; the word "understandable" as he used it is somewhat ambiguous
>>>>> and does not necessarily imply approval.
>>>>>
>>>>> Regardless, any LP member whose views are so badly skewed as to
>>>>> publish a written public article condemning as solidly libertarian a party
>>>>> leader as the current LP national chair as a "cultural Marxist" and among
>>>>> those who is "usher(ing) his own Jewish people toward the boxcars", is not
>>>>> somebody I personally want serving in the party leadership. Coupled with
>>>>> the threats that Paul Stanton and Paul Frankel report Ramsey making against
>>>>> them and against members of Stanton's family, and Ramsey's connections to
>>>>> groups like Rock Against Communism and the American Guard, if I sat on the
>>>>> Florida LP Executive Committee and had been voting, I believe I would have
>>>>> voted to remove Ramsey from that body if such action is consistent with the
>>>>> Florida LP's bylaws. But I don't know whether there was a bylaws issue, or
>>>>> why the ExCom majority voted down Paul Stanton's motion for removal. My
>>>>> suspicion that they may have made what I believe to be a bad decision isn't
>>>>> enough for me to support the LNC formally weighing in or taking action
>>>>> vis-a-vis the Florida LP, short of the conditions I describe in the first
>>>>> paragraph above being met. Short of removal, I don't know what other steps,
>>>>> if any, they have taken, or may yet take.
>>>>> But if the LNC does not make any direct formal response to the Florida
>>>>> situation, this still leaves the question of what else we can do with
>>>>> regard to the broader issue of ethno-nationalism seeping into the
>>>>> Libertarian Party. It's been pointed out that the LNC has recently issued a
>>>>> strong statement against racism and bigotry; the value of issuing another
>>>>> such statement at this time seems dubious. However while we've recently
>>>>> addressed the "ethno" aspect of the ethno-nationalist problem, I don't
>>>>> think we've adequately addressed nationalism, which is much more pervasive.
>>>>>
>>>>> Nationalism is itself, I believe, a form of bigotry akin to racism. It
>>>>> is an anti-individualist philosophy which, translated into government
>>>>> policy, results in virtually every national government in the world
>>>>> wrongfully discriminating against people on the basis of innate
>>>>> characteristics beyond their control (where they were born or who their
>>>>> parents were). It also tends to lead people to take un-libertarian
>>>>> positions, such as being willing to initiate force against immigrants,
>>>>> supporting protectionism, and accepting various rights violations in the
>>>>> name of "national security". Nationalism can also serve as a cover for
>>>>> racism, because nationalist and racist views often dovetail when it comes
>>>>> to issues like immigration, racial profiling in the name of "national
>>>>> security", the U.S. government killing people in other countries, etc. But
>>>>> despite being as repugnant as racism, nationalism has so far largely gotten
>>>>> a pass from society including from many (L)ibertarians. If we are serious
>>>>> about discouraging the sort of views that are disrupting the Florida LP,
>>>>> the LNC issuing a strong statement against nationalism seems like a very
>>>>> good idea, and I would support such a resolution. I think we should also
>>>>> pay more attention to how our messaging and other practices (e.g. use of
>>>>> the American flag) can subtly legitimize and reinforce nationalism in the
>>>>> party.
>>>>>
>>>>> Love & Liberty,
>>>>>
>>>>>                                    ((( starchild )))
>>>>> At-Large Representative, Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>                          RealReform at earthlink.net
>>>>>                                  (415) 625-FREE
>>>>>                                     @StarchildSF
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>>
>>>>> On Oct 25, 2017, at 6:14 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>> I agree with Ken.  And the RR from that area gave their input.  I can
>>>>> tell you no Region 1 state would welcome this interference.
>>>>>
>>>>> So pre-empttively since we seem so eager to get involved in affiliates
>>>>> - this RR says don't mess with Region 1 states.  They handle their own
>>>>> business.
>>>>>
>>>>> I'm hoping Oregon gets on mended terms with National.  This isn't the
>>>>> way to show states we learned our lesson from that mess.  Their Board voted
>>>>> and unless we think the whole of that leadership are secret nazis then we
>>>>> have no right or authority to be second-guessing their decision for their
>>>>> state.
>>>>>
>>>>> I routinely get complaints about such and such going on here and
>>>>> there.  I listen, tell them their rights, and say it is for their state to
>>>>> handle.  Wes brilliant release said what we needed to.  I wish we would say
>>>>> the same to the violent left.  Violence against persons and property is
>>>>> unacceptable.  Bigotry and identity collectivism of all kinds is
>>>>> unacceptable.
>>>>>
>>>>> -Caryn Ann
>>>>>
>>>>> On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 8:04 PM, Ken Moellman <ken at moellman.com>
>>>>> wrote:
>>>>>
>>>>>> A disaffiliation motion is way too extreme.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> I think the statement made by either Wes or Nick - I forget who made
>>>>>> it - about racism and whatnot being not welcome in the party was enough
>>>>>> from LP National.  Disaffiliation would take a serious infraction, IMO.
>>>>>> That a party has internal issues is nothing new and nothing to get involved
>>>>>> with.
>>>>>>
>>>>>> On Wed, Oct 25, 2017 at 9:19 PM, David Demarest <
>>>>>> dpdemarest at centurylink.net> wrote:
>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I agree that a disaffiliation investigation motion would open a can
>>>>>>> of worms. Perhaps the existing motion calling for a resolution is the wiser
>>>>>>> choice. However, it is a catch-22. How can we justify the resolution if we
>>>>>>> do not do the necessary due diligence investigation?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thoughts?
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ~David Pratt
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *May 25-27 2018 Omaha Roads to Freedom Un-Convention*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Freedom, Nothing More, Nothing Less*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ~David Pratt Demarest
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Roads to Freedom Foundation, Founder
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LNC Region 6 Representative (IA, IL, MN, MO, ND, NE, WI)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LSLA Vice-Chair
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LPNE State Central Committee, Secretary
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> LPRC Board Member, Nebraska State Coordinator
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> David.Demarest at LP.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Secretary at LPNE.org
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DPDemarest at centurylink.net
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> DPrattDemarest at gmail.com
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Cell:      402-981-6469 <(402)%20981-6469>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Home: 402-493-0873 <(402)%20493-0873>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *From:* Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] *On
>>>>>>> Behalf Of *Joshua Katz
>>>>>>> *Sent:* Wednesday, October 25, 2017 1:52 PM
>>>>>>> *To:* lnc-business at hq.lp.org
>>>>>>> *Subject:* [Lnc-business] Fwd: [Lnc-votes] Resignation From LPF
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Thank you to both Steven, Paul Frankel, and Tom Knapp for inserting
>>>>>>> much-needed facts into this discussion.  In light of these facts, I think
>>>>>>> vigilance is called for, but do not think it is appropriate, at this time,
>>>>>>> to make a relevant motion.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I will note, without getting into the weeds, that while I won't
>>>>>>> quibble with facts alleged about Florida, I would disagree with some of the
>>>>>>> statements made about certain national groups, or in other ways about the
>>>>>>> dangerous movement we face.  I think they are more dangerous than they've
>>>>>>> been described here, and while in the past I considered them individually
>>>>>>> dangerous, I now consider them to be an organizational threat - and a
>>>>>>> threat to the modern world which made freedom possible.  (Murray Rothbard
>>>>>>> pointed out, in 1965, that freedom was made possible by the overthrow of
>>>>>>> the Ancien Regime, and I think the pre-modern thinking on the right, and
>>>>>>> the post-modern thinking on the left, are both creating an environment
>>>>>>> where it can return.)  I consider them, at the moment, the most immediate
>>>>>>> threat to freedom in our culture, since they have organized and gone beyond
>>>>>>> being individual cranks - they now are making moves on the world of ideas,
>>>>>>> which controls the rest.  And remember that far too many people associate
>>>>>>> us with them.  The Charlottesville morons (if it brings them any comfort, I
>>>>>>> think I speak on behalf of all Jews when I say that none of us desire to be
>>>>>>> mouth-breathing bigots carrying tiki torches, so their fears about us
>>>>>>> replacing them are misplaced) used a banner which was based on the Albany
>>>>>>> Plan of Union banner - and one of the snake pieces was labeled L.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In any event, as concerns Florida, I think the analysis is pretty
>>>>>>> straightforward, although the determinations are not.  Is there a problem?
>>>>>>> I am convinced there is, and I am convinced we should not ignore it and
>>>>>>> blind ourselves to it.  Another party tried that approach, as well as
>>>>>>> "well, we'll bring them along for their votes on the things we agree
>>>>>>> about," and now is largely unable to get candidates who actually favor its
>>>>>>> basic ideas through primaries.  The next question, the crucial question, is
>>>>>>> - can the affiliate fix it?  (A related, but somewhat different question,
>>>>>>> is whether it wants to.)  I think the answer to that is yes.  There is, of
>>>>>>> course, a tipping point - a point where rather than try to fix the problem,
>>>>>>> good people simply leave, and the ability to fix the problem goes away.
>>>>>>> And good people are, it seems clear to me, leaving.  I still do not think
>>>>>>> the tipping point has been reached, though.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Joshua A. Katz
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> At-Large Representative,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Libertarian National Committee
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ---------- Forwarded message ----------
>>>>>>> From: <travellingcircus at gmail.com>
>>>>>>> Date: Tue, Oct 24, 2017 at 12:21 PM
>>>>>>> Subject: Re: [Lnc-votes] [Lnc-business] Resignation From LPF
>>>>>>> To: "Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org" <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>,
>>>>>>> Independent Political Report <independent-political-report@
>>>>>>> googlegroups.com>, "iprtwo at googlegroups.com" <
>>>>>>> iprtwo at googlegroups.com>, erin.adams at lp.org, Whitney Bilyeu <
>>>>>>> whitneycb76 at gmail.com>, Joshua Katz <joshua.katz at lp.org>, David
>>>>>>> Demarest <David.Demarest at lp.org>, Daniel Hayes <daniel.hayes at lp.org>,
>>>>>>> Ed Marsh <ednmax at yahoo.com>, Steven Nekhaila <
>>>>>>> Steven.Nekhaila at gmail.com>, Starchild <sfdreamer at earthlink.net>,
>>>>>>> Paul Stanton <paul at stanton.name>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm writing to LNC members who commented in this thread plus Whitney
>>>>>>> as my rep, IPR teamCCed for background, and Paul Stanton CCed. If any of
>>>>>>> the LNC members copied feel it's worth sharing with the rest of LNC please
>>>>>>> do so. If not, my feelings won't be hurt either.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm not going to comment on what if anything LNC should do, just lay
>>>>>>> out the facts as I know them,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Just before Paul Stanton resigned from LPF exec comm he submitted
>>>>>>> the following to that body (see links embedded in original):
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://groups.google.com/forum/embed/#!topic/lpfec/7Ii6WazfTGo
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> -------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Greetings,
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Tonight's motion 520 is mainly regarding threats and advocacy of
>>>>>>> violence against me and others, including a current US Senate candidate and
>>>>>>> former rules chair of the Libertarian Party of Miami-Dade.  Additionally,
>>>>>>> he is a leader in a white supremacist group, the American Guard
>>>>>>> <http://adl.org/blog/behind-the-american-guard-hardcore-white-supremacists>,
>>>>>>> a spin-off group of the violent anti-immigrant Sons of Odin - founded by Brien
>>>>>>> James
>>>>>>> <https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/brien-james> (who
>>>>>>> also founded the Vinlanders - a Neo-Nazi group responsible for dozens of
>>>>>>> murders).  The crossed cleavers in their shield is a reference to 19th century
>>>>>>> anti-immigrant gang leader, Bill the Butcher
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Poole> - an advocacy of
>>>>>>> violence against immigrants.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ryan Ramsey himself covers white nationalist "Rock Against Communism
>>>>>>> <https://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism>" bands like S
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skrewdriver>crewdriver
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skrewdriver>, and advocates for Operation
>>>>>>> Werewolf <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Werwolf>.  He has called
>>>>>>> the LNC Chair Nick Sarwark "Nazi Nick," citing Nick's Jewish religion, then
>>>>>>> blaming people "disingenuous political leaders like Nick Sarwark" for the
>>>>>>> rise of the Nazi Party and ultimately the Holocaust.
>>>>>>> <http://archive.is/EMZPY>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Here are some links which I will be referencing tonight at the
>>>>>>> meeting:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://www.facebook.com/libertarianheathen/photos/a.
>>>>>>> 1959795147587414.1073741828.1954915414742054/2002228056677456/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <https://www.facebook.com/libertarianheathen/photos/a.1959795147587414.1073741828.1954915414742054/2002228056677456/%3Cbr+/%3E>
>>>>>>> https://www.adl.org/blog/behind-the-american-guard-
>>>>>>> hardcore-white-supremacists
>>>>>>> http://libertarianheathen.com
>>>>>>> http://archive.is/t5jC7
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Bottom line, I am sick of seeing threats of violence against good
>>>>>>> Libertarians, and others disassociating in disgust over the intimidation
>>>>>>> tactics, dehumanization, and white supremacist rhetoric being employed by
>>>>>>> leaders within our party.  If we allow one of our leaders to threaten our
>>>>>>> membership while having the ability to stop it, voters and donors have no
>>>>>>> reason to take our party seriously, as we clearly do not.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The delegates very clearly gave us the ability to remove people from
>>>>>>> the EC for violation of the non-aggression pledge.  Tonight we must decide
>>>>>>> if we will take that task seriously or not.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> In liberty,
>>>>>>> *Paul Stanton*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Folowup message: *
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> [          ]
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Info about the 1930s German Nazi history book that Ryan Ramsey took
>>>>>>> his meme from:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://spartacus-educational.com/Jewish_Children.htm
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ------------------------------------------------------------
>>>>>>> ---------------------------------
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Frankel: I can also attest to the threats coming from Ramsey, his
>>>>>>> former close associate Augustus Invictus and others in their circle.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Back in April of this year, on a tip from IPR site owner Warren
>>>>>>> Redlich, I published http://independentpoliticalreport.
>>>>>>> com/2017/04/police-report-augustus-invictus-accused-of-
>>>>>>> domestic-violence-sexual-assault-kidnapping/  detailing that Mr.
>>>>>>> Invictus' ex-fiancee made these very serious allegations against him. I
>>>>>>> confirmed with the police department in question that the referenced report
>>>>>>> had in fact been filed. I made no comment in the article about the truth or
>>>>>>> falsehood of the allegations. Any comments of opinions I made in the
>>>>>>> comment section on the same basis as any of our other readers and clearly
>>>>>>> marked as opinion. Notably, the complaintant and associate of hers also
>>>>>>> reported death threats at the time from Invictus and Ramsey, who have since
>>>>>>> then (very recently) had a falling out. Witness tampering was also one of
>>>>>>> the allegations.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I also *republished* http://independentpoliticalreport.
>>>>>>> com/2017/04/libertarians-united-against-fascism-to-the-
>>>>>>> cowardly-collaborators-of-the-libertarian-party-of-florida-
>>>>>>> and-a-call-to-action-against-them/
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/libertarians-united-against-fascism-to-the-cowardly-collaborators-of-the-libertarian-party-of-florida-and-a-call-to-action-against-them/>
>>>>>>> (note that the original and its website were taken down so the images no
>>>>>>> longer appear; scroll down to see the section about Ryan Ramsey as the last
>>>>>>> part of the article).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> As a response, 1) Augustus Invictus wrote me and Warren Redlich,
>>>>>>> insinuating possible legal action and hinting at other forms of
>>>>>>> retaliation; he later wrote another former associate of his, Raquel Okyay,
>>>>>>> which was later forwarded to me, naming me as one of the people he plans to
>>>>>>> take some form of unspecified revenge on.   2) Ryan Ramsey published two
>>>>>>> articles filled with outright lies and slanderous fictions about me,
>>>>>>> Redlich, and others alleging some grand conspiracy . You can find them at
>>>>>>> libertarianheathen.com with a search for Frankel. Ramsey and his
>>>>>>> associates continually spread this crap on FB and probably elsewhere.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://libertarianheathen.com/?s=frankel
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The slanderous lies from Ramsey were tit for tat retaliation – he
>>>>>>> said so himself, and offered a reciprocal unpublishing – because I reported
>>>>>>> the news that his then buddy Augustus Invictus, one of the Charlottesville
>>>>>>> organizers, had been accused of a pattern of domestic violence, kidnapping
>>>>>>> and rape by his ex-fiancee. I was simply reporting the news, not taking a
>>>>>>> stance, except in the comments; and even there I was careful to separate
>>>>>>> what I knew to be fact from my opinion and what others alleged.
>>>>>>> Furthermore, I reposted accurate reporting about Ryan Ramsey and his
>>>>>>> associates previously published elsewhere. His response was to
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1) Publish lies about me, Warren Redlich and IPR, linked above
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2) Offer to take them down if we took down our own reporting
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3) Threaten to sic law enforcement on me for supposedly being a
>>>>>>> terrorist and threatening his wife, none of which is even remotely true.
>>>>>>> Specifically, he said he had contacted the Florida Department of Law
>>>>>>> Enforcement electronic crimes division and was planning to meet with the
>>>>>>> FBI and tell them that I am a terrorist (a preposterous lie) and that I
>>>>>>> threatened his then pregnant wife (another absurd fiction).
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 4) His pal Invictus broached the possibility of suing us (but said
>>>>>>> he wasn’t doing that, at least at that time)
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 5) Invictus later issued a non-specific threat against me and a few
>>>>>>> other people saying we will “get what is coming to us.” Among many other
>>>>>>> people he and his associates have threatened.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ryan Ramsey’s article is in fact full of attacks, slander and lies.
>>>>>>> Looking at just the headline alone: I am not editor in chief at IPR and in
>>>>>>> fact there is no such position. I am not a terrorist, and that is a
>>>>>>> slanderous claim. Moving beyond the headline I address numerous inaccurate
>>>>>>> statements, slanders, libel and downright lies in Ramsey’s article in a
>>>>>>> series of comments starting at http://independentpoliticalreport.
>>>>>>> com/2017/04/libertarians-united-against-fascism-write-
>>>>>>> open-letter-to-lnc-starchild-responds/#comment-1581189 and
>>>>>>> continuing over a couple of dozen comments.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> To take one egregious example, Ramsey continually asserts that I had
>>>>>>> something to do with killing a dog. I did not, and while he is not the
>>>>>>> first person to spread this lie it is nevertheless a lie and he is not
>>>>>>> repeating it as a statement by someone else but rather as something he
>>>>>>> knows to be true, unlike the statements about him by others that I have
>>>>>>> published. There are many similar falsehoods throughout the article which I
>>>>>>> addressed in IPR comments.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Others who have been threatened by Invictus, Ramsey and friends
>>>>>>> include *Tom Knapp *
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-
>>>>>>> perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-
>>>>>>> approach/#comment-1636145
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *"**To date, twice when the AI combination pity party / threat
>>>>>>> machine got cranked up and I was involved in direct back and forth, I
>>>>>>> escalated from Condition Yellow to Condition Orange. This involves, among
>>>>>>> other things, making my family aware of a possible threat, ensuring that at
>>>>>>> least one person in the household in addition to myself has a loaded
>>>>>>> firearm near to hand at all times, and paying special attention to street
>>>>>>> traffic in my neighborhood (which is very low traffic so anything unusual
>>>>>>> stands out, and I have a nearby neighbor who knows to call if anything
>>>>>>> looks suspicious as well). "*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Frankel again) The email I was forwarded from Invictus says in part
>>>>>>> *"**Stanton, Tesky, Wyllie, Marchetti, and Frankel **are all
>>>>>>> directly responsible for that, because the babysitter called the police
>>>>>>> based off the bullshit criminal allegations being pushed by those five. It
>>>>>>> was the ‘news’ story that caused the babysitter to call the police. Fourth
>>>>>>> and final: It never crossed my mind that Joe (Wendt) had anything to do
>>>>>>> with that, but if I find out that he was involved with Stanton or Tesky or
>>>>>>> Marchetti in pushing those criminal allegations, I will hang him with my
>>>>>>> own fucking hands. That entire situation is something so outrageous that I
>>>>>>> am not even discussing it. Each and every person who was involved or had
>>>>>>> knowledge of it will get what is coming to them.**"*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And in fact, all of the people named, myself included, are among
>>>>>>> many others who have reported being threatened by Invictus, Ramsey and
>>>>>>> their circle of associates. Ramsey is still neck deep in it even now that
>>>>>>> Invictus has become a Republican.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Ramsey is allegedly gloating about Stanton's resignation in these
>>>>>>> facebook groups, among others:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Kekistan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The Right Way: No Cucks, Only Kek
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Republic of Kekistan
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> @The Deplorables and Basement Dwellers for Trump
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anti-SJW
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Anti-SJW Pinochet's Beach Party
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> The ex-fiancee of Invictus, Ms. Rice, and her friend Ms. Brown along
>>>>>>> with others they knew also reported being threatened and intimidated by
>>>>>>> Invictus, Ramsey et al.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/08/joe-wendt-for-us-
>>>>>>> senate-new-lp-of-florida-chair-undermines-libertarian-
>>>>>>> principles-in-favor-of-white-nationalists/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Libertarian Party Candidate for U.S. Senate, Joe Wendt, condemns
>>>>>>> LPF Chair, Marcos Miralles, for pursuing a policy that promotes white
>>>>>>> nationalists within the Libertarian Party of Florida. “Mr. Miralles has
>>>>>>> appointed known white nationalists to leadership positions.”*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *...*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *“I have been threatened with physical violence by white nationalist
>>>>>>> supporters of Miralles,” said Wendt. “*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> <http://goog_1698321734/>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-
>>>>>>> perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/
>>>>>>> see embedded links in original"
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *We are losing good members, and the trust of the public, due to the
>>>>>>> elevation of leaders in extremist hate groups to our party leadership.  We
>>>>>>> need a new approach.  Local libertarian-leaning politicians and voters
>>>>>>> associate us with far-right extremists.  As of yesterday, my county no
>>>>>>> longer has a full slate of candidates for the Florida House.   One of the
>>>>>>> Libertarian candidates I drafted will now unfortunately be running NPA.
>>>>>>> Yesterday, we also lost our incoming Rules Committee chair.  Previously,
>>>>>>> both our former gubernatorial nominee and our senatorial nominee (prior to
>>>>>>> me) have resigned their LPF memberships, among countless other Libertarian
>>>>>>> activists and volunteers.  A member of my 2016 Senate campaign ended her
>>>>>>> participation with the party, because her employer forbids associations
>>>>>>> with members of extremist hate groups advocating for violence. A single
>>>>>>> friend (who ceased her participation after receiving death threats) has
>>>>>>> reported that no fewer than 30 of her acquaintances have withdrawn from
>>>>>>> Libertarian Party activism due to risks to themselves and their
>>>>>>> reputations.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *During my US Senate campaign, I never expected the situation that
>>>>>>> unfolded.  I expected the personal attacks, but I never expected racist
>>>>>>> fantasies about my mother, posting of personal information about members of
>>>>>>> my family, or the violent threats and sexual harassment targeting my
>>>>>>> supporters and members of my campaign.  Last month, after I introduced a
>>>>>>> motion (which was killed) to remove Florida’s member of the Libertarian
>>>>>>> Party Platform Committee for his racist statements
>>>>>>> <http://rationalwiki.org/wiki/Anti-racist_is_a_code_word_for_anti-white#.22The_mantra.22>,
>>>>>>> I was accused of wanting to kill all white people, in a “white genocide
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_genocide_conspiracy_theory>”
>>>>>>> conspiracy theory.  And now today, there have been threats that
>>>>>>> the militant <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Soldiers_of_Odin> hate
>>>>>>> <http://www.theindychannel.com/longform/who-are-the-american-guard-patriotic-nationalists-or-skinheads-in-disguise> group
>>>>>>> <https://godsandradicals.org/2017/03/18/heathen-know-nothings-the-american-guard/> the
>>>>>>> <http://forward.com/fast-forward/368055/white-supremacists-and-skinheads-join-pro-trump-rally/> American
>>>>>>> Guard
>>>>>>> <https://www.adl.org/blog/behind-the-american-guard-hardcore-white-supremacists>may
>>>>>>> be waiting for me in the parking lot, or harassing county party meetings.
>>>>>>> We must have higher standards for our party leadership!*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Sadly, these are common intimidation tactics among white
>>>>>>> nationalists, and there are several other victims throughout Florida.  This
>>>>>>> behavior cannot be accepted.  We cannot continue to elevate these people.
>>>>>>> Libertarianism stands for maximum freedom for everyone, universally. We
>>>>>>> dishonor ourselves and our party by enabling liars with wildly divergent
>>>>>>> philosophies, who stand immediately adjacent to neo-Nazis
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/National_Socialist_Movement_(United_States)>, white
>>>>>>> nationalists
>>>>>>> <https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/group/vinlanders-social-club>, fascists
>>>>>>> <https://johnmhudak.com/2017/07/16/rise-of-the-anarcho-statists-part-iii-augustus-sol-invictus-the-unconquerable-sun-god/>,organized
>>>>>>> criminal syndicates
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Outlaws_Motorcycle_Club>, and domestic
>>>>>>> terrorists <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_Front>.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> From the comments:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 1.     *Starchild <http://www.openborders.info/>**July 22, 2017 at
>>>>>>> 09:26*
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/#comment-1634719>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Joe, do you know which individuals were shouting “white power” at
>>>>>>> the state convention? Is there video evidence of this? I would hope those
>>>>>>> individuals are identified and ostracized, and that other Libertarians will
>>>>>>> make clear to them that there is no room for such racism in the LP. That is
>>>>>>> not what we are about. If individuals who seek to act in such a manner
>>>>>>> leave the party, that is not a loss for us but a gain.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 2.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> 3.     *Joe Wendt**July 22, 2017 at 12:10*
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/#comment-1634766>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Starchild,*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *The individuals in question are supports of the current LPF Chair.
>>>>>>> Although Augustus Invictus, the most prominent of the White Nationalists,
>>>>>>> has left the party, unfortunately other less prominent White Nationalists
>>>>>>> are not [only -p] remaining active in the LPF, the Chair is actually giving
>>>>>>> them positions of authority.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Screenshot of Ramsey threatening to knock Wendt’s teeth out and
>>>>>>> saying he may have an “accident”*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/wp-content/uploads/2017/
>>>>>>> 07/received_10159060778305274.png
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> paulie <https://www.facebook.com/paulie.cannoli>July 23, 2017 at
>>>>>>> 12:04
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/#comment-1635134>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Again, it’s not about Joe.* Yes Ramsey threatened Joe, but he also
>>>>>>> threatened many other people, as has Invictus and their other buddies.
>>>>>>> There are numerous sources for that, including me. *Yes, Ramsey has
>>>>>>> spread bullshit about me. I think he is still doing it although I haven’t
>>>>>>> checked lately. Did he know it to be false or did he just repeat what other
>>>>>>> people said? Well, he couldn’t have known it to be true since it was not
>>>>>>> true and he did not say “so and so says” he just repeated things as if they
>>>>>>> were facts and added new ones such as the bullshit about me being a
>>>>>>> terrorist and member of a terrorist groups and the bullshit about me making
>>>>>>> threats against his wife. And again, *these are just examples just
>>>>>>> as the other examples in Stanton’s article are only examples.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *The real issue is that there is an ongoing pattern as reported by
>>>>>>> many different people of Invictus, Ramsey and their circle of friends
>>>>>>> issuing threats, spreading lies .. to and about many different people ..
>>>>>>> and maintaining ongoing close associations with multiple white supremacist
>>>>>>> groups and violent groups and individuals.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> ....
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Ramsey says “You were awful meek last night punk. Ill see you soon
>>>>>>> though and well see how mouthy you are”* which is clearly physical
>>>>>>> intimidation. Joe is talking shit on the internet but Ramsey says he will
>>>>>>> not do it in person. Why not? Clearly due to threat of physical violence.
>>>>>>> Ramsey follows this up with *“Id be more concerned with the teeth
>>>>>>> in your mouth at this point joe. Your dental plan good?” *which in
>>>>>>> the context of his earlier statement is not exactly a very veiled threat.
>>>>>>> If he was genuinely concerned about Joe slipping and falling due to being
>>>>>>> drunk, which is laughable in the context of the conversation, he would not
>>>>>>> have made the threat so specific.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And the larger context of course is that there have been many other
>>>>>>> threats, to many other people, myself as well as this publication (IPR)
>>>>>>> included.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Joe WendtJuly 23, 2017 at 13:55
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/#comment-1635174>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *To Andy,*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *I have contacted the police. Since it has not progressed beyond
>>>>>>> Facebook, they told me to block him and contact them again if he continues
>>>>>>> the harassing and threatening behavior. They will be called if he threatens
>>>>>>> me again.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> paulie <https://www.facebook.com/paulie.cannoli>July 23, 2017 at
>>>>>>> 14:19
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/07/paul-stanton-perhaps-working-with-white-nationalists-is-not-the-best-approach/#comment-1635179>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Also, if all of these if all of these violent threats have been
>>>>>>> made, why hasn’t anyone gone to jail? Has anyone even gotten a restraining
>>>>>>> order?*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Don’t be naive. Threats are not always made in a verifiable,
>>>>>>> provable form. I’ve received plenty of threats over the years, including
>>>>>>> death threats, and I have never felt the urge to go to the cops about it.
>>>>>>> What the fuck are they going to do? While they conduct their half assed
>>>>>>> investigation I may get killed or injured or whatever else. Or someone else
>>>>>>> around me.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> And one of the people that has been threatened by Invictus, Ramsey
>>>>>>> and friends made a good point. This person said that Ramsey has known
>>>>>>> contacts in law enforcement and that there are known ties between many
>>>>>>> members of law enforcement and white supremacist groups such as the ones
>>>>>>> Ramsey and Invictus have a lot of ties to. So reporting anything to law
>>>>>>> enforcement may actually be cutting your own throat if you get threatened
>>>>>>> by these assholes.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> FL: Augustus Invictus campaigns in front of white nationalist
>>>>>>> skinhead music banner
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2015/12/fl-augustus-invictus-campaigns-in-front-of-white-nationalist-skinhead-music-banner/>
>>>>>>>   http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2015/12/fl-augustus-
>>>>>>> invictus-campaigns-in-front-of-white-nationalist-skinhead-
>>>>>>> music-banner/
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2015/12/fl-augustus-invictus-campaigns-in-front-of-white-nationalist-skinhead-music-banner/>
>>>>>>> Note: Ramsey also frequently associates with that same banner to this day.
>>>>>>> "Rock Against Communism" may sound like something that libertarians would
>>>>>>> agree with, but in reality it's a well-known neo-nazi front organization
>>>>>>> that no "former" white supremacist (as Ramsey claims to be) would have any
>>>>>>> association with.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *The Rock Against Communism movement originated in the **United
>>>>>>> Kingdom <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_Kingdom>** in late
>>>>>>> 1978 with **far right <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Far_right>** activists
>>>>>>> associated with the **National Front
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Front>** (NF).**[4]
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism#cite_note-soundtrack-4>** It
>>>>>>> was intended to counter the **Rock Against Racism
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Racism>** organisation.**[4]
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism#cite_note-soundtrack-4>** The
>>>>>>> first RAC concert was in **Leeds
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leeds>**, **England
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/England>** in 1978, featuring the **Nazi
>>>>>>> punk <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nazi_punk>** bands The Dentists
>>>>>>> and The Ventz.**[5]
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism#cite_note-5>** RAC
>>>>>>> held one concert in 1979 and another in spring 1983, which was headlined
>>>>>>> by **Skrewdriver <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skrewdriver>**, a **white
>>>>>>> power rock <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/White_power_rock>** band
>>>>>>> led by **Ian Stuart Donaldson
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ian_Stuart_Donaldson>**. After that,
>>>>>>> RAC concerts were held more often. They were often headlined by Skrewdriver
>>>>>>> and featured other white power bands, such as **Skullhead
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Skullhead>** and **No Remorse
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/No_Remorse_(band)>**. In the
>>>>>>> mid-1980s, summer concerts were often held at the **Suffolk
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Suffolk>** home of **Edgar Griffin
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Edgar_Griffin>**, a **Conservative
>>>>>>> Party <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Conservative_Party_(UK)>*
>>>>>>> * activist**[6]
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism#cite_note-6>** and
>>>>>>> father of **Nick Griffin
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nick_Griffin>**, an NF organiser who
>>>>>>> later became the national chair of the **British National Party
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party>**. By the
>>>>>>> late 1980s, the RAC name had given way to the White Noise Club (another
>>>>>>> NF-based group), and later **Blood and Honour
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Blood_and_Honour>**, which was set
>>>>>>> up by **Donaldson <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Donaldson>** when
>>>>>>> they fell out with the NF leadership.**[4]
>>>>>>> <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rock_Against_Communism#cite_note-soundtrack-4>*
>>>>>>> * As **hardcore punk <https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hardcore_punk>** music
>>>>>>> became more popular in the 1990s and 2000s, many white power bands took on
>>>>>>> a more hardcore-influenced sound.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Note that Ryan Ramsey continues to proudly wave the "Rock against
>>>>>>> communism" banner.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Chuck Moulton: ‘LP conventions, avoid alt-right / white supremacist
>>>>>>> event speakers’
>>>>>>> <http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/05/chuck-moulton-lp-conventions-avoid-alt-right-white-supremacist-event-speakers/>
>>>>>>>  http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/05/chuck-moulton-lp-
>>>>>>> conventions-avoid-alt-right-white-supremacist-event-speakers/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> More background:
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/alexandria-brown-
>>>>>>> response-to-ryan-ramsey-and-timeline-of-events/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/update-on-rape-
>>>>>>> assault-kidnapping-and-witness-tampering-allegations-
>>>>>>> against-augustus-invictus/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/update-on-
>>>>>>> augustus-invictus-criminal-allegations-and-retraction-of-
>>>>>>> censure-from-florida-lp-possible-disaffiliation-by-lnc-floated/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/david-colborne-
>>>>>>> augustus-sol-invictus-is-not-welcome-in-my-state/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/knppster-were-
>>>>>>> going-to-shut-it-down/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/04/knapp-replace-lp-
>>>>>>> of-florida-exec-comm-and-bylaws/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/08/paul-stanton-lp-
>>>>>>> florida-chair-marcos-miralles-must-resign/ :
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Marcos Miralles began his race for Chair of the LPF with the
>>>>>>> support of Augustus Sol Invictus
>>>>>>> <https://www.splcenter.org/fighting-hate/extremist-files/individual/augustus-sol-invictus-austin-gillespie>**and
>>>>>>> Ryan Ramsey, both leaders in white supremacist groups, including the
>>>>>>> American Guard
>>>>>>> <https://www.adl.org/blog/behind-the-american-guard-hardcore-white-supremacists>**.
>>>>>>>  (The American Guard was one of the groups present in Charlottesville last
>>>>>>> weekend.
>>>>>>> <http://www.theindychannel.com/news/local-news/indianapolis/indiana-american-guard-among-protestors-at-charlottesville-unite-the-right-rally>**)
>>>>>>>  Invictus was also a featured speaker at the Charlottesville white
>>>>>>> supremacist rally.
>>>>>>> <http://www.orlandosentinel.com/news/politics/political-pulse/os-augustus-invictus-charlottesville-20170814-story.html>**  The
>>>>>>> support has not been one-sided.  Last year, Marcos Miralles provided a town
>>>>>>> hall for Invictus
>>>>>>> <http://www.miamiherald.com/news/politics-government/election/article97524342.html>** (as
>>>>>>> part of a campaign to stir up drama during the primary), the pictures from
>>>>>>> which are still used by the Miami Herald to associate our party with
>>>>>>> Invictus <http://www.miamiherald.com/news/local/article167083427.html>**.
>>>>>>> Additionally, he proudly displayed Ryan Ramsey’s endorsement on his website
>>>>>>> and appointed Ryan Ramsey <https://docs.lpf.org/meeting/july-16th-2017/>** to
>>>>>>> our Legislative Review Committee.  There is no place for white supremacy in
>>>>>>> the Libertarian Party of Florida.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Thankfully, there was a recent press release
>>>>>>> <https://lpf.org/2017/08/libertarian-party-florida-first-strongest-voice-hate-filled-groups/> condemning
>>>>>>> the events in Charlottesville.  Unfortunately, Marcos Miralles has refused
>>>>>>> to condemn the white supremacists within our party, or recant his previous
>>>>>>> support.  Instead, he insists that he will “work with everybody” and has
>>>>>>> dismissed worries about white supremacists using our party to support their
>>>>>>> platform as “non sense,” despite the support of the previously-mentioned
>>>>>>> Libertarians, and despite the Libertarian Party of Florida’s representative
>>>>>>> to the Libertarian Party platform committee, Frank Caprio.  Caprio
>>>>>>> regularly makes very racist comments, including quotes white
>>>>>>> supremacist Bob Whitaker
>>>>>>> <https://www.splcenter.org/hatewatch/2017/06/07/bob-whitaker-author-racist-mantra-white-genocide-has-died>.
>>>>>>> I physically cringed when I read Marcos write: “The Libertarian Party of
>>>>>>> Florida will forever remain the safest home for all of those that fight for
>>>>>>> civil rights.”  As one of the Libertarian victims of violent threats and
>>>>>>> harassment (a Muslim mother of biracial children) stated, “The Libertarian
>>>>>>> Party was not a safe haven for me and many others like me.  It should be,
>>>>>>> by principle. […] But that’s not the present day reality.”  Sadly, she
>>>>>>> ended her participation with the party after concerns with the safety of
>>>>>>> her family. When she reached out to Miralles, she was ignored and blocked
>>>>>>> on social media.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/05/knapp-dickey-
>>>>>>> cover-2017-libertarian-party-of-florida-convention/ http://
>>>>>>> independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/05/knapp-dickey-
>>>>>>> cover-2017-libertarian-party-of-florida-convention/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *There were people yelling white power. Larry Sharpe went on an
>>>>>>> alt-right vlog by Ryan Ramsey called the Mad American Network. That group
>>>>>>> was with Invictus in Harrisburg, PA and at least one member, Dave Martel,
>>>>>>> was seen sieg heiling there. Invictus chased someone out of a courtesy
>>>>>>> suite with threats of violence. Invictus was then pushing Paul Stanton
>>>>>>> trying to pick a fight. There was loud applause of his speech where he
>>>>>>> hijacked our convention for five minutes, then just bragged about it…*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *…our gubernatorial candidate denied Stanton a mic for a privileged
>>>>>>> motion, so that he could procedurally kill a pro-immigration platform plank
>>>>>>> without letting it be read.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> *Thomas Knapp lost an ad hoc election to the LP platform committee
>>>>>>> to a “constitutional conservative” who once told me, “anti-racist is code
>>>>>>> for anti-white,” Frank Caprio. He’s from the LP of Orange County (Orlando
>>>>>>> area, same as Invictus -p).*
>>>>>>> *Oh, and by the way – no pretend antifa protesters showed up, of
>>>>>>> course.*
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/09/paul-frankel-why-
>>>>>>> libertarians-need-to-denounce-the-alt-right-and-white-
>>>>>>> nationalists-and-dont-need-to-worry-about-libertarian-
>>>>>>> socialists-and-antifa/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> http://independentpoliticalreport.com/2017/08/lsla-2017-
>>>>>>> physically-removed-so-to-speak-making-the-lp-
>>>>>>> inhospitable-to-the-alt-right-and-other-nazis/
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> I'm sure that's more than enough for now, but there's plenty more.
>>>>>>> Feel free to email or call 205-534-1622 <(205)%20534-1622> to
>>>>>>> discuss, and forward wherever or whenever you wish.
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>> Paul Frankel
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
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>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
>>>>>>>
> _______________________________________________
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