[Lnc-business] Point of order regarding abstention and alternate voting

[Caryn Ann Harlos]

PS: to clarify I’m only appealing a portion of the ruling.  I do not
contest that abstentions should not count in calculating the percentage- on
my tally sheet I used that number 13 which is total cast and 10 is 3/4.

I appeal the part that rules that an express abstention paves the way for
the alternate vote to count.  It would lead to the absurd result that a
regional who responds “present” would be contacted as absent.

On Mon, Feb 11, 2019 at 4:19 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
wrote:

> I appeal from the ruling of the Chair.
>
> In email votes how is this handled?
>
> On Mon, Feb 11, 2019 at 4:11 PM Nicholas Sarwark via Lnc-business <
> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
>
>> Dear All,
>>
>> Not voting is not a vote. Everything else is commentary.
>>
>> Under Robert’s Rules, an abstention, express or otherwise, is not a vote.
>> They may be noted for clarity, such as accurately reflecting that a member
>> was present for the purposes of quorum, or that the member didn’t miss the
>> vote, but they do not change the vote count and do not count for the
>> calculations of 2/3 or 3/4 unless there is a particular rule that refers to
>> the number of members in the committee or number of members in attendance.
>> By default, vote thresholds are of members “present and voting.”
>>
>> A regional alternate does not get a vote except in the absence of a
>> regional representative’s vote, by stepping away from the table at an
>> in-person meeting or by abstaining in a mail ballot.
>>
>> In absence of a specific rule in the bylaws or policy manual about
>> express abstentions (as opposed to custom or past practice), Mr.
>> O’Donnell’s abstention does not count as a vote for either the purpose of
>> how many votes are required to meet the 3/4 threshold or for preventing Mr.
>> Lyons’ vote from being counted as regional alternate and tallied.
>>
>> Yours truly,
>> Nick
>>
>> P.S. If you would like to read more about the abstention issue, which is
>> very commonly misunderstood, the following links may be of interest:
>> http://www.robertsrules.com/faq.html#6
>>
>> https://www.lawoforderblog.com/2018/03/4-things-most-people-get-wrong-about-abstentions/
>> https://www.davis-stirling.com/HOME/Voting-Abstention
>
> --
>
> *  In Liberty,*
>
> *Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary *- Caryn.Ann.
> Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
> *Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee* - LPedia at LP.org
> Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page at
> facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/
>
> =========================================================================
> Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism * Re-Legalize All
> Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom * Repeal All Gun Laws *
> Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish The Fed * End
> Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and Repeal the Income Tax
> * Privatize Transportation Infrastructure * Free-market Emergency Services
> * Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools To The Private Sector *
> Eliminate Regulation *
>
> *VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US or http://www.LP.org <http://www.lp.org/>*
> =========================================================================
>
-- 

*  In Liberty,*

*Libertarian Party and Libertarian National Committee Secretary *- Caryn.Ann.
Harlos at LP.org <Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> or Secretary at LP.org.
*Chair, LP Historical Preservation Committee* - LPedia at LP.org
Call me at 561.523.2250 and follow my public figure page at
facebook.com/pinkflameofliberty/

=========================================================================
Peaceful Commerce With All Nations * Non-interventionism * Re-Legalize All
Drugs * End Government Intrusion In The Bedroom * Repeal All Gun Laws *
Abolish All Taxation * Sound, Free-market Money * Abolish The Fed * End
Corporate & Individual Welfare * Abolish The IRS and Repeal the Income Tax
* Privatize Transportation Infrastructure * Free-market Emergency Services
* Open Migration * Transfer Government Schools To The Private Sector *
Eliminate Regulation *

*VOTE LIBERTARIAN * 800-ELECT-US or http://www.LP.org <http://www.lp.org/>*
=========================================================================