[Lnc-business] Can we put out a poll to the delegates who voted for an in person convention

Wed Jul 1 14:54:50 EDT 2020

I object and agree with Sam.  You do not have the authority to send such a
poll over the objections of the LNC unless the Chair has overridden the
LNC.  Has he?

*In Liberty,*

* Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
(part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If anyone
found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social faux
pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *

On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 12:42 PM Sam Goldstein <sam.goldstein at lp.org> wrote:

> I object.  Such a simplistic poll does not even begin to address the
> financial consequences to the party of a cancellation.
>
> ---
> Sam Goldstein, At Large Member
> Libertarian National Committee
> Convention Oversight Committee
> 317-850-0726 Cell
>
> On 2020-07-01 14:36, Daniel Fishman via Lnc-business wrote:
> > What I plan to send. I think the attendance question is important.  I
> > will
> > close the poll at midnight 3:am Eastern. I tried to gracefully
> > incorporate
> > the "rescind" language.
> >
> > [image: image.png]
> > ---
> > Daniel Fishman
> > Executive Director
> > The Libertarian Party
> > Join Us <http://www.lp.org/join>
> >
> >
> > On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 1:55 PM Caryn Ann Harlos
> > <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> > wrote:
> >
> >> If the contract cannot be worked out that is out of our hands.  I
> >> wanted
> >> the poll yesterday.  Now I am done wasting my limited time on useless
> >> exercises that we will then argue endlessly over.  My bandwidth is at
> >> its
> >> end.
> >>
> >> *In Liberty,*
> >>
> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's Syndrome
> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >> anyone
> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >> faux
> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>
> >>
> >>
> >> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 11:42 AM <john.phillips at lp.org> wrote:
> >>
> >>> I get your point, but I disagree.  We have plenty of evidence that
> >>> the
> >>> delegates want to be polled that is reason enough to take the 5
> >>> minutes to
> >>> do it, and if they say have the convention than all is good anyway.
> >>> If
> >>> they say don't we have a data point to base a decision on.
> >>>
> >>> In reality sitting on the call last night there are some contract
> >>> concerns that need to be worked out, and if they can't then it is
> >>> moot.
> >>>
> >>> John Phillips
> >>> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 12:33 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>  I do not agree with that wording.  It does not answer for me the
> >>> question that needs to be answered.
> >>>
> >>> And frankly it is too late.  Imagine if we spent this time doing
> >>> something productive.
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 11:05 AM <john.phillips at lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Oh for the love of god can we just do the poll.
> >>>
> >>> Poll the delegates from Memorial day weekend.
> >>>
> >>> Ask them very simply:
> >>> Would you vote to have an in person convention in Orlando July 8th
> >>> thru
> >>> 12th.
> >>> Yes, No, Nota.
> >>>
> >>> At this point it wont matter with the screwing around going on as we
> >>> won't be able to meet in time to cancel even if they all vote to do
> >>> so, but
> >>> lets do the damn poll so we at least know how bad it is.
> >>>
> >>> John Phillips
> >>> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 11:46 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you weighting the state chairs according to the number of
> >>> delegates?
> >>> If not, it is not representative.  Colorado has significantly more
> >>> delegates than other states.  You cannot use the state chairs as
> >>> representing delegates without that calculation.
> >>>
> >>> It is too late.  I asked for this poll early yesterday.  It is
> >>> absolutely
> >>> unethical at this point to turn people's lives upside down when we
> >>> have a
> >>> location.
> >>>
> >>> I have not agreed with a lot of the criticisms of this body - there
> >>> has
> >>> been shady business going on and we were dealt a bad hand.  If we
> >>> cancel
> >>> when we have a location over the will of delegates at convention,
> >>> this
> >>> body
> >>> has no business being anywhere near leadership.  It is wrong, and it
> >>> is
> >>> robbing people who spent money and a violation of the principle of
> >>> the
> >>> non-initiation of force.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 9:15 AM Richard Longstreth <
> >>> richard.longstreth at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > I'm not good with wording polls but if someone is, I'd like to get
> this
> >>> > started sooner rather than later. I find wisdom in hearing from the
> >>> > delegates on this. My state chairs are, almost entirely, saying to
> not
> >>> > approve a third venue. Absent a poll of delegates, I intend to
> >>> represent
> >>> > their opinion and trust that they are representing their delegates to
> >>> me. I
> >>> > cannot poll everyone in the region myself at this point, let alone
> have
> >>> > contact info for all of the delegates for speedy communication.
> >>> >
> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >
> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >
> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 20:51 Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> As far as wording that is not my call.  But bad wording will kill
> the
> >>> >> entire usefulness.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 9:50 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >>> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> > The poll should be only those credentialed at the Sunday session
> of
> >>> the
> >>> >> > first part of the convention.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > They made a decision.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 6:54 PM Daniel Fishman <
> dan.fishman at lphq.org>
> >>>
> >>> >> > wrote:
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >> Would you like me to poll all current members?  All delegates?
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> What would you like the wording to be?
> >>> >> >> ---
> >>> >> >> Daniel Fishman
> >>> >> >> Executive Director
> >>> >> >> The Libertarian Party
> >>> >> >> Join Us <http://www.lp.org/join>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 7:54 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>> Mr Hagan apologies if I was hasty though I do think in this
> >>> rapidly
> >>> >> >>> changing situation we must be checking our emails hourly.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> My proposal is to poll only the delegates we are seeking to
> >>> overturn.
> >>> >> >>> Those credentialed at the session that voted for the in person
> >>> >> >>> convention.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 5:19 PM Richard Longstreth via
> >>> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> > I am supportive.
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> >> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT,
> WA,
> >>> WY)
> >>> >> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> >> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 15:37 Tim Hagan via Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > > You shouldn't interpret silence as disapproval. Some people
> >>> aren't
> >>> >> >>> > > constantly checking their e-mails, could be working, or
> still
> >>> >> >>> processing
> >>> >> >>> > > this news thrown at us last night and have questions.
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > I don't have a problem with taking a poll, unless if we're
> >>> going
> >>> >> to
> >>> >> >>> > > waste time arguing over the wording or who gets polled (e.g.
> >>> all
> >>> >> >>> > > delegates, delegates & alternates credentialed in May,
> etc.).
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > ---
> >>> >> >>> > > Tim Hagan
> >>> >> >>> > > Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > On 2020-06-30 14:20, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > > A poll could have already gone out from the national
> office.
> >>> >> Yet
> >>> >> >>> > > > except
> >>> >> >>> > > > for you - silence on this post.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > That is wrong.  Are we scared of what they might say?  I
> >>> >> actually
> >>> >> >>> think
> >>> >> >>> > > > they might have changed their mind, but I need to know
> that
> >>> for
> >>> >> >>> sure.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > > communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.  If
> >>> >> >>> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > > faux
> >>> >> >>> > > > pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> let
> >>> me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > > *
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 1:05 PM <john.phillips at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Agreed.  I am informally polling my region, but that is
> >>> just
> >>> >> one
> >>> >> >>> > > >> region.
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> John Phillips
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> On Jun 30, 2020 1:26 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business
> >>> <
> >>> >> >>> > > >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Here is something we all need to take seriously.  The
> >>> delegates
> >>> >> >>> voted
> >>> >> >>> > > >> for
> >>> >> >>> > > >> an in person convention.  I don't really think we have
> the
> >>> >> right
> >>> >> >>> to
> >>> >> >>> > > >> cancel
> >>> >> >>> > > >> if we have a location which we do.  It is usurping their
> >>> >> decision.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> But
> >>> >> >>> > > >> they may think differently now.  Can we poll them so we
> >>> know
> >>> >> what
> >>> >> >>> we
> >>> >> >>> > > >> should
> >>> >> >>> > > >> do?  This isn't about us.  It is about particular state
> >>> chairs
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> >>> > > >> particular regions.  It is about the delegate that gave
> us
> >>> >> >>> specific
> >>> >> >>> > > >> marching orders.  Can we find out what THEY want?
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > >> communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.
> >>> >> If
> >>> >> >>> > > >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > >> faux
> >>> >> >>> > > >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> >>> let me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> --
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> >>> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >> --
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> > communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> > pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > --
> >>> >>
> >>> >> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >>
> >>> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >>> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 12:33 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>  I do not agree with that wording.  It does not answer for me the
> >>> question that needs to be answered.
> >>>
> >>> And frankly it is too late.  Imagine if we spent this time doing
> >>> something productive.
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 11:05 AM <john.phillips at lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Oh for the love of god can we just do the poll.
> >>>
> >>> Poll the delegates from Memorial day weekend.
> >>>
> >>> Ask them very simply:
> >>> Would you vote to have an in person convention in Orlando July 8th
> >>> thru
> >>> 12th.
> >>> Yes, No, Nota.
> >>>
> >>> At this point it wont matter with the screwing around going on as we
> >>> won't be able to meet in time to cancel even if they all vote to do
> >>> so, but
> >>> lets do the damn poll so we at least know how bad it is.
> >>>
> >>> John Phillips
> >>> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 11:46 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you weighting the state chairs according to the number of
> >>> delegates?
> >>> If not, it is not representative.  Colorado has significantly more
> >>> delegates than other states.  You cannot use the state chairs as
> >>> representing delegates without that calculation.
> >>>
> >>> It is too late.  I asked for this poll early yesterday.  It is
> >>> absolutely
> >>> unethical at this point to turn people's lives upside down when we
> >>> have a
> >>> location.
> >>>
> >>> I have not agreed with a lot of the criticisms of this body - there
> >>> has
> >>> been shady business going on and we were dealt a bad hand.  If we
> >>> cancel
> >>> when we have a location over the will of delegates at convention,
> >>> this
> >>> body
> >>> has no business being anywhere near leadership.  It is wrong, and it
> >>> is
> >>> robbing people who spent money and a violation of the principle of
> >>> the
> >>> non-initiation of force.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 9:15 AM Richard Longstreth <
> >>> richard.longstreth at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > I'm not good with wording polls but if someone is, I'd like to get
> this
> >>> > started sooner rather than later. I find wisdom in hearing from the
> >>> > delegates on this. My state chairs are, almost entirely, saying to
> not
> >>> > approve a third venue. Absent a poll of delegates, I intend to
> >>> represent
> >>> > their opinion and trust that they are representing their delegates to
> >>> me. I
> >>> > cannot poll everyone in the region myself at this point, let alone
> have
> >>> > contact info for all of the delegates for speedy communication.
> >>> >
> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >
> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >
> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 20:51 Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> As far as wording that is not my call.  But bad wording will kill
> the
> >>> >> entire usefulness.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 9:50 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >>> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> > The poll should be only those credentialed at the Sunday session
> of
> >>> the
> >>> >> > first part of the convention.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > They made a decision.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 6:54 PM Daniel Fishman <
> dan.fishman at lphq.org>
> >>>
> >>> >> > wrote:
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >> Would you like me to poll all current members?  All delegates?
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> What would you like the wording to be?
> >>> >> >> ---
> >>> >> >> Daniel Fishman
> >>> >> >> Executive Director
> >>> >> >> The Libertarian Party
> >>> >> >> Join Us <http://www.lp.org/join>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 7:54 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>> Mr Hagan apologies if I was hasty though I do think in this
> >>> rapidly
> >>> >> >>> changing situation we must be checking our emails hourly.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> My proposal is to poll only the delegates we are seeking to
> >>> overturn.
> >>> >> >>> Those credentialed at the session that voted for the in person
> >>> >> >>> convention.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 5:19 PM Richard Longstreth via
> >>> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> > I am supportive.
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> >> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT,
> WA,
> >>> WY)
> >>> >> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> >> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 15:37 Tim Hagan via Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > > You shouldn't interpret silence as disapproval. Some people
> >>> aren't
> >>> >> >>> > > constantly checking their e-mails, could be working, or
> still
> >>> >> >>> processing
> >>> >> >>> > > this news thrown at us last night and have questions.
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > I don't have a problem with taking a poll, unless if we're
> >>> going
> >>> >> to
> >>> >> >>> > > waste time arguing over the wording or who gets polled (e.g.
> >>> all
> >>> >> >>> > > delegates, delegates & alternates credentialed in May,
> etc.).
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > ---
> >>> >> >>> > > Tim Hagan
> >>> >> >>> > > Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > On 2020-06-30 14:20, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > > A poll could have already gone out from the national
> office.
> >>> >> Yet
> >>> >> >>> > > > except
> >>> >> >>> > > > for you - silence on this post.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > That is wrong.  Are we scared of what they might say?  I
> >>> >> actually
> >>> >> >>> think
> >>> >> >>> > > > they might have changed their mind, but I need to know
> that
> >>> for
> >>> >> >>> sure.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > > communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.  If
> >>> >> >>> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > > faux
> >>> >> >>> > > > pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> let
> >>> me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > > *
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 1:05 PM <john.phillips at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Agreed.  I am informally polling my region, but that is
> >>> just
> >>> >> one
> >>> >> >>> > > >> region.
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> John Phillips
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> On Jun 30, 2020 1:26 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business
> >>> <
> >>> >> >>> > > >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Here is something we all need to take seriously.  The
> >>> delegates
> >>> >> >>> voted
> >>> >> >>> > > >> for
> >>> >> >>> > > >> an in person convention.  I don't really think we have
> the
> >>> >> right
> >>> >> >>> to
> >>> >> >>> > > >> cancel
> >>> >> >>> > > >> if we have a location which we do.  It is usurping their
> >>> >> decision.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> But
> >>> >> >>> > > >> they may think differently now.  Can we poll them so we
> >>> know
> >>> >> what
> >>> >> >>> we
> >>> >> >>> > > >> should
> >>> >> >>> > > >> do?  This isn't about us.  It is about particular state
> >>> chairs
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> >>> > > >> particular regions.  It is about the delegate that gave
> us
> >>> >> >>> specific
> >>> >> >>> > > >> marching orders.  Can we find out what THEY want?
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > >> communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.
> >>> >> If
> >>> >> >>> > > >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > >> faux
> >>> >> >>> > > >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> >>> let me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> --
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> >>> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >> --
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> > communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> > pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > --
> >>> >>
> >>> >> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >>
> >>> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >>> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 12:33 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>>  I do not agree with that wording.  It does not answer for me the
> >>> question that needs to be answered.
> >>>
> >>> And frankly it is too late.  Imagine if we spent this time doing
> >>> something productive.
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 11:05 AM <john.phillips at lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Oh for the love of god can we just do the poll.
> >>>
> >>> Poll the delegates from Memorial day weekend.
> >>>
> >>> Ask them very simply:
> >>> Would you vote to have an in person convention in Orlando July 8th
> >>> thru
> >>> 12th.
> >>> Yes, No, Nota.
> >>>
> >>> At this point it wont matter with the screwing around going on as we
> >>> won't be able to meet in time to cancel even if they all vote to do
> >>> so, but
> >>> lets do the damn poll so we at least know how bad it is.
> >>>
> >>> John Phillips
> >>> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>>
> >>> On Jul 1, 2020 11:46 AM, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> Are you weighting the state chairs according to the number of
> >>> delegates?
> >>> If not, it is not representative.  Colorado has significantly more
> >>> delegates than other states.  You cannot use the state chairs as
> >>> representing delegates without that calculation.
> >>>
> >>> It is too late.  I asked for this poll early yesterday.  It is
> >>> absolutely
> >>> unethical at this point to turn people's lives upside down when we
> >>> have a
> >>> location.
> >>>
> >>> I have not agreed with a lot of the criticisms of this body - there
> >>> has
> >>> been shady business going on and we were dealt a bad hand.  If we
> >>> cancel
> >>> when we have a location over the will of delegates at convention,
> >>> this
> >>> body
> >>> has no business being anywhere near leadership.  It is wrong, and it
> >>> is
> >>> robbing people who spent money and a violation of the principle of
> >>> the
> >>> non-initiation of force.
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>>
> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>> On Wed, Jul 1, 2020 at 9:15 AM Richard Longstreth <
> >>> richard.longstreth at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>>
> >>> > I'm not good with wording polls but if someone is, I'd like to get
> this
> >>> > started sooner rather than later. I find wisdom in hearing from the
> >>> > delegates on this. My state chairs are, almost entirely, saying to
> not
> >>> > approve a third venue. Absent a poll of delegates, I intend to
> >>> represent
> >>> > their opinion and trust that they are representing their delegates to
> >>> me. I
> >>> > cannot poll everyone in the region myself at this point, let alone
> have
> >>> > contact info for all of the delegates for speedy communication.
> >>> >
> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT, WA, WY)
> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >
> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >
> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 20:51 Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business <
> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >
> >>> >> As far as wording that is not my call.  But bad wording will kill
> the
> >>> >> entire usefulness.
> >>> >>
> >>> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 9:50 PM Caryn Ann Harlos <
> >>> caryn.ann.harlos at lp.org
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> wrote:
> >>> >>
> >>> >> > The poll should be only those credentialed at the Sunday session
> of
> >>> the
> >>> >> > first part of the convention.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > They made a decision.
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 6:54 PM Daniel Fishman <
> dan.fishman at lphq.org>
> >>>
> >>> >> > wrote:
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> >> Would you like me to poll all current members?  All delegates?
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> What would you like the wording to be?
> >>> >> >> ---
> >>> >> >> Daniel Fishman
> >>> >> >> Executive Director
> >>> >> >> The Libertarian Party
> >>> >> >> Join Us <http://www.lp.org/join>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 7:54 PM Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>
> >>> >> >>> Mr Hagan apologies if I was hasty though I do think in this
> >>> rapidly
> >>> >> >>> changing situation we must be checking our emails hourly.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> My proposal is to poll only the delegates we are seeking to
> >>> overturn.
> >>> >> >>> Those credentialed at the session that voted for the in person
> >>> >> >>> convention.
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 5:19 PM Richard Longstreth via
> >>> Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> > I am supportive.
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Richard Longstreth
> >>> >> >>> > Region 1 Representative (AK, AZ, CO, HI, KS, MT, NM, OR, UT,
> WA,
> >>> WY)
> >>> >> >>> > Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > richard.longstreth at lp.org
> >>> >> >>> > 931.538.9300
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > Sent from my Mobile Device
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020, 15:37 Tim Hagan via Lnc-business <
> >>> >> >>> > lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> > > You shouldn't interpret silence as disapproval. Some people
> >>> aren't
> >>> >> >>> > > constantly checking their e-mails, could be working, or
> still
> >>> >> >>> processing
> >>> >> >>> > > this news thrown at us last night and have questions.
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > I don't have a problem with taking a poll, unless if we're
> >>> going
> >>> >> to
> >>> >> >>> > > waste time arguing over the wording or who gets polled (e.g.
> >>> all
> >>> >> >>> > > delegates, delegates & alternates credentialed in May,
> etc.).
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > ---
> >>> >> >>> > > Tim Hagan
> >>> >> >>> > > Treasurer, Libertarian National Committee
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> > > On 2020-06-30 14:20, Caryn Ann Harlos via Lnc-business
> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > > A poll could have already gone out from the national
> office.
> >>> >> Yet
> >>> >> >>> > > > except
> >>> >> >>> > > > for you - silence on this post.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > That is wrong.  Are we scared of what they might say?  I
> >>> >> actually
> >>> >> >>> think
> >>> >> >>> > > > they might have changed their mind, but I need to know
> that
> >>> for
> >>> >> >>> sure.
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > > communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.  If
> >>> >> >>> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > > faux
> >>> >> >>> > > > pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> let
> >>> me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > > *
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > > On Tue, Jun 30, 2020 at 1:05 PM <john.phillips at lp.org>
> >>> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Agreed.  I am informally polling my region, but that is
> >>> just
> >>> >> one
> >>> >> >>> > > >> region.
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> John Phillips
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Libertarian National Committee Region 6 Representative
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Cell 217-412-5973
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> On Jun 30, 2020 1:26 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos via
> Lnc-business
> >>> <
> >>> >> >>> > > >> lnc-business at hq.lp.org> wrote:
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> Here is something we all need to take seriously.  The
> >>> delegates
> >>> >> >>> voted
> >>> >> >>> > > >> for
> >>> >> >>> > > >> an in person convention.  I don't really think we have
> the
> >>> >> right
> >>> >> >>> to
> >>> >> >>> > > >> cancel
> >>> >> >>> > > >> if we have a location which we do.  It is usurping their
> >>> >> decision.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> But
> >>> >> >>> > > >> they may think differently now.  Can we poll them so we
> >>> know
> >>> >> what
> >>> >> >>> we
> >>> >> >>> > > >> should
> >>> >> >>> > > >> do?  This isn't about us.  It is about particular state
> >>> chairs
> >>> >> in
> >>> >> >>> > > >> particular regions.  It is about the delegate that gave
> us
> >>> >> >>> specific
> >>> >> >>> > > >> marching orders.  Can we find out what THEY want?
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *  In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>> > > >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as
> >>> Asperger's
> >>> >> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> > > >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect
> >>> inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> > > >> communication skills in both personal and electronic
> >>> arenas.
> >>> >> If
> >>> >> >>> > > >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> > > >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some
> >>> other
> >>> >> >>> social
> >>> >> >>> > > >> faux
> >>> >> >>> > > >> pas) in an actual email, please contact me privately and
> >>> let me
> >>> >> >>> know.
> >>> >> >>> > > >> *
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > > >>
> >>> >> >>> > >
> >>> >> >>> >
> >>> >> >>> --
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >>> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> >>> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> >>> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> >> anyone
> >>> >> >>> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> >>> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> >>> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >>>
> >>> >> >> --
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > *In Liberty,*
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> >>> Syndrome
> >>> >> > (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> > communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> > found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other
> social
> >>> >> faux
> >>> >> > pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >> >
> >>> >> > --
> >>> >>
> >>> >> *In Liberty,*
> >>> >>
> >>> >> * Personal Note:  I have what is commonly known as Asperger's
> Syndrome
> >>> >> (part of the autism spectrum).  This can affect inter-personal
> >>> >> communication skills in both personal and electronic arenas.  If
> >>> anyone
> >>> >> found anything offensive or overly off-putting (or some other social
> >>> faux
> >>> >> pas), please contact me privately and let me know. *
> >>> >>
> >>> >
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
> >>>
>