[Lnc-business] Policy Manual - Regional Representatives

Mon Jun 27 08:21:40 EDT 2016

Caryn, thanks for the clarifications and I agree with your latest revision.

And, yes, much of my concern would be alleviated by Sam’s suggestion of a brief post-convention LNC orientation session for new LNC members. I did not seek the Region 6 Representative. Not knowing what was involved, I was completely caught by surprise as it evolved. That being said, it is a good fit and I enthusiastically accept the challenge. However, my initial reaction was “Wow this is a great opportunity, but now what?”

If the regional organization is a value add to the LNC, and I emphatically think it is, than surely the LNC should take it seriously and provide clear, unambiguous and documented guidance on regional representative responsibilities if for no other reason than providing a viable pipeline for future LNC talent.

~David Pratt Demarest

Region 6 Representative, Libertarian National Committee

From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On Behalf Of Caryn Ann Harlos
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 11:23 PM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] Policy Manual - Regional Representatives

All,

I note that the Bylaws state,

Representative regions" may be formed or dissolved once every two years during a  period beginning 90 days before the beginning of and ending on the second day of the  National Convention, and notice of new formations or dissolutions must be given  in  writing to the national Secretary prior to the close of the Convention at which they take  place. 

So there is something that must be reduced to writing, even if it is just "hey we're a region now."  But I see that my proposed change to David's proposal does make it seem like something much more formal is required.  So I would change my wording to:

LNC Regional Representatives and Alternates who serve at the pleasure of the State Chairs of the affiliates comprising their Region or as specified in the Region Formation Agreement if any, are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and Officers and members of the regional state affiliates. Actual regional organization policies and additional duties are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their Regional Representatives and Alternates.

and for clarification, I don't think David is proposing a motion... he is seeking discussion which may lead to a motion, but I think more airing out an issue that exists.

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

PS: remember, please sign your emails... the sender information is often unclear when this goes to the public list, and the members can have a hard time keeping track of who said what, and they deserve to know.

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 8:37 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <carynannharlos at gmail.com <mailto:carynannharlos at gmail.com> > wrote:

Thank you for the clarification. 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

PS: remember, please sign your emails... the sender information is often unclear when this goes to the public list, and the members can have a hard time keeping track of who said what, and they deserve to know.

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 8:34 PM, Alicia Mattson <agmattson at gmail.com <mailto:agmattson at gmail.com> > wrote:

The Delegation Chair's Manual says:

"Some regions opt to use regional formation agreements to document mutually agreed upon rules for their region before any future disputes arise.  A recommended basic regional agreement is included at the end of this document, though you are not required to use this particular one or any one at all."

This motion suggests that each region has one, and it includes information beyond just "We're a region!"

-Alicia

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 7:20 PM, Caryn Ann Harlos <carynannharlos at gmail.com <mailto:carynannharlos at gmail.com> > wrote:

Alicia, it was my understanding from the Delegate Chair Manual that every region does have to sign a region formation agreement, even if it was something as simple as "We're a region!"  - that would be the agreement.

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

PS: remember, please sign your emails... the sender information is often unclear when this goes to the public list, and the members can have a hard time keeping track of who said what, and they deserve to know.

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 8:18 PM, Alicia Mattson <agmattson at gmail.com <mailto:agmattson at gmail.com> > wrote:

I agree with Ken here in terms of how useful this would be.  If someone isn't going to read the bylaws and see how the region reps work, why would they read the policy manual to see someone else's attempt to describe what's in the bylaws?  I don't see this as solving the described problem.

I also would quibble with some of the language.  For example, not every region has a region formation agreement, though this language suggests they do.  Some merely sign a piece of paper saying "We're a region!"

-Alicia

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 10:54 AM, Ken Moellman <ken.moellman at lpky.org <mailto:ken.moellman at lpky.org> > wrote:

All,

As designed and codified in the bylaws today, the regions are autonomous, and have the right to determine their own reps as they see fit (by mutual agreement, or otherwise by the state chairs by default).  The Region Representative represents the region. They serve the region at their leisure. This is already codified in the bylaws. I don't see a reason to reiterate this any further in other documents.  I would suggest that it would only clutter the already-lengthy document.

In 2014, I suggested reorganizing regions based on Federal Court districts, with multiple districts in each region to make the national membership numbers in each region almost equal. The goal of this approach was to foster communication between states in the same federal court circuits, since Court of Appeals ruling effect every state in the district.   This never gained traction for multiple reasons, the largest of which seemed to be protecting silly fiefdoms. I've personally moved on to build those relationships outside of the Region Reps.  I introduced LPKY's attorney to the counsel for LPTN and LPMI at the national convention, and LPKY's attorney has now worked with LPO's attorney.

I do think we should consider reducing the number of regions and at-large positions by 1, keeping a balance between those elected by the entire body and those elected from districts.

Just my $0.02 on the matter.

---

Ken C. Moellman, Jr.
LNC Region 3 Alternate Representative
LPKY Judicial Committee

On 2016-06-26 13:36, Caryn Ann Harlos wrote:

There is a problem.  Whether this is a solution or not is another matter, but I think it certainly adds clarity. We must remember that the Policy Manual isn't *only* for the LNC but for the members to *understand* the LNC.  I read it when I was a new member (no wisecracks Sam!).  Now I realize I am an aberration in  my zeal to read our documents but that is in fact another purpose of it.  Most members have zero idea they even have a regional representative, and in fact, what use such a person is.  Perhaps the un-regioned (made that word up) states would be more likely to join a region if they saw the value and the value was made a part of the record.   

This is definitely a problem because there are regional representatives who come in going now what?  I found myself in a different position in that I was already entrenched as a non-LNC member in the goings on, attending and writing about meetings, reading the lists etc, and did an active campaign for the position that I decided on well in advance.  But oftentimes (whether this is good or not is another issue) regional representatives are chosen and decided at the region meeting with little prior intent.  Either no one campaigned, or someone decides they don't like the choices, and heck, better step up.  Whatever the reason, we find ourselves with absolutely no guidance on what the heck it is we are supposed to do.  The fact is, I just took it upon myself to start doing things and interfacing with my region in ways I thought were a good idea, but it would be great to know what has been learned from the past.  Again.... institutional knowledge, we are terrible at it.

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

PS: remember, please sign your emails... the sender information is often unclear when this goes to the public list, and the members can have a hard time keeping track of who said what, and they deserve to know.

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 11:14 AM, David Demarest <dpdemarest at centurylink.net <mailto:dpdemarest at centurylink.net> > wrote:

I am good with Caryn's suggested revision.

Others?

~David Pratt Demarest

Region 6 Representative, Libertarian National Committee

From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org> ] On Behalf Of David Demarest
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 12:04 PM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] Policy Manual - Regional Representatives

Thanks Caryn. I have pasted in the previous responses for background information.

~David Pratt Demarest

From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On Behalf Of Caryn Ann Harlos
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 11:45 AM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
Subject: [Lnc-business] Policy Manual - Regional Representatives

I am starting this new chain for the discussion on David's proposal to add a section to the Policy Manual on Regional Representatives.  This was David's initial working proposal as a starting point:

LNC regional representatives and alternates who serve at the pleasure of the region member state chairs are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and officers and members of the regional state organizations. Actual regional organization policies are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their regional representatives and alternates.

I suggest this change:

LNC Regional Representatives and Alternates who serve at the pleasure of their Region, as specified in the Region Formation Agreement, are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and Officers and members of the regional state affiliates. Actual regional organization policies and additional duties are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their Regional Representatives and Alternates.

-- 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org <mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> 

Thanks Caryn. Can you provide an alternative example and how we might modify the proposed statement to address that alternative?

Thoughts?

Celebrate Life, Set the Bar High and LIVE FREE!

The Invisible Hand of Self-Interest is Mightier Than the Sword of Government!

From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On Behalf Of Caryn Ann Harlos
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 10:59 AM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
Cc: david.demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:david.demarest at firstdata.com> ; David Demarest <secretary at lpne.org <mailto:secretary at lpne.org> >; lnc-business <lnc-business at lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at lp.org> >
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] details for electronic mail ballots

Yes that is what I was thinking- a policy manual section.

David also, not all reps serve at the pleasure of the state chairs- that is the default.  The region agreement can specify otherwise.

From: David Demarest [mailto:secretary at lpne.org] 
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 11:13 AM
To: 'Sam Goldstein' <goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com <mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> >; 'lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> ' <lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> >
Cc: 'lnc-business' <lnc-business at lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at lp.org> >; 'david.demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:david.demarest at firstdata.com> ' <david.demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:david.demarest at firstdata.com> >
Subject: RE: [Lnc-business] details for electronic mail ballots

Thanks Sam – makes sense to put it in the policy manual. What is the procedure to get a Regional Representative responsibilities statement added to the policy manual?

By the way, the original idea for the following suggested policy statement came from the fertile mind of Brett Bittner, Region 3 Representative. Thanks Brett!

LNC regional representatives and alternates who serve at the pleasure of the region member state chairs are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and officers and members of the regional state organizations. Actual regional organization policies are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their regional representatives and alternates.

Any suggested revisions to the above text?

The Invisible Hand of Self-Interest is Mightier Than the Sword of Government!

~David Pratt Demarest

From: Lnc-business [mailto:lnc-business-bounces at hq.lp.org] On Behalf Of Caryn Ann Harlos
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 11:16 AM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
Cc: david.demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:david.demarest at firstdata.com> ; lnc-business <lnc-business at lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at lp.org> >
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] details for electronic mail ballots

David, can you start a new thread with the right title?  This is still under "electronic email ballot" and will be impossible to find in the future.

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 10:13 AM, David Demarest <secretary at lpne.org <mailto:secretary at lpne.org> > wrote:

Thanks Sam – makes sense to put it in the policy manual. What is the procedure to get a Regional Representative responsibilities statement added to the policy manual?

By the way, the original idea for the following suggested policy statement came from the fertile mind of Brett Bittner, Region 3 Representative. Thanks Brett!

LNC regional representatives and alternates who serve at the pleasure of the region member state chairs are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and officers and members of the regional state organizations. Actual regional organization policies are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their regional representatives and alternates.

Any suggested revisions to the above text?

The Invisible Hand of Self-Interest is Mightier Than the Sword of Government!

~David Pratt Demarest

Secretary, Nebraska Libertarian State Central Committee

Region 6 Representative, Libertarian National Committee

Secretary at LPNE.org <mailto:Secretary at LPNE.org> 

David.Demarest at LP.org <mailto:David.Demarest at LP.org>  

DPDemarest at centurylink.net <mailto:DPDemarest at centurylink.net>  

David.Demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:David.Demarest at firstdata.com> 

http://www.LPNE.org <http://www.lpne.org/> 

http://www.LP.org <http://www.lp.org/>   

Cell:      402-981-6469 <tel:402-981-6469> 

Home: 402-493-0873 <tel:402-493-0873> 

Office: 402-222-7207 <tel:402-222-7207> 

From: Sam Goldstein [mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com <mailto:goldsteinatlarge at gmail.com> ] 
Sent: Sunday, June 26, 2016 10:37 AM
To: lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
Cc: lnc-business <lnc-business at lp.org <mailto:lnc-business at lp.org> >; david.demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:david.demarest at firstdata.com> ; David Demarest <secretary at lpne.org <mailto:secretary at lpne.org> >
Subject: Re: [Lnc-business] details for electronic mail ballots

David,

The LNC has no power to change the By-Laws, only the delegates in convention.  The LNC can amend the Policy Manual so it might be best to look for a place to insert your suggested Regional Representative responsiblities language in that document.  There are very few mentions of Regional Reps in the current language and the only responsibility outlined is the Regional Report to be submitted prior to every LNC meeting.

Having a definition inserted in the Policy Manual would help future newbies in determining their role and might encourage more people to seed a spot from their region.

Live Free,

Sam Goldstein

Libertarian National Committee

Member at Large

8925 N Meridian St, Ste 101

Indianapolis IN 46260

317-850-0726 <tel:317-850-0726>  Phone

317-582-1773 <tel:317-582-1773>  Fax

On Sun, Jun 26, 2016 at 9:33 AM, David Demarest <dpdemarest at centurylink.net <mailto:dpdemarest at centurylink.net> > wrote:

Alicia – Thank you for very clear and unambiguous instructions and procedures on LNC email balloting – very helpful to us newcomers on the board!

On a similar but separate subject, at your convenience when your schedule is not so crazy, I would appreciate receiving similar instructions and procedures excerpted from the bylaws or elsewhere in LNC documentation that  clearly delineates the roles and responsibilities of regional representatives and their alternates. With Caryn Ann Harlos' help, I see some of region structure mechanical details. However, I have not been able to locate any LNC documentation that spells out regional representative and alternate roles and responsibilities. 

Caryn Ann and I have discussed a possible default description of regional representative and alternate roles and responsibilities. I submit the following for discussion:

LNC regional representatives and alternates who serve at the pleasure of the region member state chairs are encouraged to provide a transparent channel that facilitates mutually supportive communication between the LNC and officers and members of the regional state organizations. Actual regional organization policies are left to the discretion of and agreement between the member state chairs and their regional representatives and alternates.

Question: Should the above be offered as a motion or as an amendment to the bylaws? If a motion is appropriate, in addition to Caryn, are there two more board members that would like to co-sponsor such a motion following discussion and revisions?

Thoughts?

Celebrate Life, Set the Bar High and LIVE FREE!

~David Pratt Demarest

Secretary, Nebraska Libertarian State Central Committee

Region 6 Representative, Libertarian National Committee

Secretary at LPNE.org <mailto:Secretary at LPNE.org> 

David.Demarest at LP.org <mailto:David.Demarest at LP.org>  

DPDemarest at centurylink.net <mailto:DPDemarest at centurylink.net>  

David.Demarest at firstdata.com <mailto:David.Demarest at firstdata.com> 

http://www.LPNE.org <http://www.lpne.org/> 

http://www.LP.org <http://www.lp.org/>   

Cell:      402-981-6469 <tel:402-981-6469> 

Home: 402-493-0873 <tel:402-493-0873> 

Office: 402-222-7207 <tel:402-222-7207> 

_______________________________________________
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-- 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org <mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> 

_______________________________________________
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http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org

-- 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org <mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> 

_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
Lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org

_______________________________________________
Lnc-business mailing list
Lnc-business at hq.lp.org <mailto:Lnc-business at hq.lp.org> 
http://hq.lp.org/mailman/listinfo/lnc-business_hq.lp.org

-- 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org <mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> 

-- 

In Liberty,

Caryn Ann Harlos

Region 1 Representative 

(Alaska, Arizona, Colorado, Hawaii, Kansas, Montana, Utah, Wyoming, Washington)

Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org <mailto:Caryn.Ann.Harlos at LP.org> 

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